instancing in indigo

instancing in indigo

Postby plot-paris » Tue Jun 17, 2008 9:43 am

I would love to see how far you can get indigo in concerns of instancing.
(I know kwistenbiebel and whaat did some quite impressive examples already ;) ).

my first test with instancing and dummies within SketchUp:

one of these tripple helix shapes has a file size of 3.5 Mb.
I used 2500 instances in the render - the export took less than a minute!
and indigo used only 175 Mb ram (instead of 3.5 x 2500 = 8750 Mb)




what were your results with playing with instances / component dummies?

I am looking forward to see all your nice, impressive, stunning, funny images :D
0
User avatar
plot-paris 
 

Re: instancing in indigo

Postby Whaat » Tue Jun 17, 2008 6:34 pm

Instancing tests are cool! I hope to see some more!

If you want to get really creative, use a combination of dummy instancing+SketchyPhysics...and make good use of Didier's wonderful component spray tool.
0

Whaat 
PluginStore Author
PluginStore Author
 

Re: instancing in indigo

Postby plot-paris » Wed Jun 18, 2008 1:04 pm

thanks for the idea, Whaat. I messed arround with tree proxies and was soon at 10 000 instances. took an awfully long time to export ;)

I pushed the use of proxies a bit further and wanted to find out, if nested proxies are possible (proxies within proxies)



well, obviously they are - what a wonderful tool! so you can create immensly detailed and complicated models and still be able to work fluently in SU? Great!

I then created some simple buildings (based on the same component), assembled these to building blocks and created a nice city area.
unfortunately my pc (Core2Duo @ 3.0 Ghz, 2 Gb Ram) can't cope with it anymore.

indigo, as well as the skindigo exporter seem to break down, if it gets too complicated (I wouldn't have expected differently). :)
now I would very much like to know, if the possible complexity depends on the power of the machine or on indigo itself.
I did a short test of a reduced city model (1/20 of it's original size). still took a long time to export...



it would be great if one of you guys with the incredibly powerful monster computers (like Coen) had a try. thus we knew, if it solely depends on the machine - and I have to save a lot of money to buy a new one ;)

here is the file (the whole city with 1920 buildings is only 200 kb):
city.skp


thanks,

Jakob
0
User avatar
plot-paris 
 

Re: instancing in indigo

Postby kwistenbiebel » Wed Jun 18, 2008 1:06 pm

Very cool test.
Also very creative to make a proxy of a group of proxies. Why didn't I think about that before ? :) .

The city is great! Superb even when you look at the files size Only 192 Kb ;)
0
Last edited by kwistenbiebel on Wed Jun 18, 2008 1:30 pm, edited 2 times in total.

kwistenbiebel 
 

Re: instancing in indigo

Postby remus » Wed Jun 18, 2008 1:27 pm

Jakob, your exports are probably failing because they run out of RAM. If you got some spare cash waiting to be spent you could fork out for a couple more gigabytes, youd probably have enough to do a lot bigger scenes.

Gotta try out proxies again, your tests are pretty inspiring.
0

remus 
 

Re: instancing in indigo

Postby plot-paris » Wed Jun 18, 2008 1:49 pm

right you are, remus. I just tried again... indigo crashes after my use of ram rises beyond 2,5 Gb (and I have only 2Gb physical Ram).
I hoped to prevent this by enabling instances. but I am afraid my city has to wait until I got some money left ;)

remus wrote:Gotta try out proxies again, your tests are pretty inspiring.

that was my intention! :D
kwistenbiebel, remus; I am looking forward to see what you come up with!
0
User avatar
plot-paris 
 

Re: instancing in indigo

Postby kwistenbiebel » Wed Jun 18, 2008 2:06 pm

I did my share of experiments I believe ;).
Never had Indigo crashing, even when having millions of polygons.
I guess the 8Gb Ram I have installed comes to use in this case.
0

kwistenbiebel 
 

Re: instancing in indigo

Postby Stinkie » Wed Jun 18, 2008 4:18 pm

8 Gb? Wuss! :twisted:
0
User avatar
Stinkie 
 

Re: instancing in indigo

Postby remus » Wed Jun 18, 2008 4:53 pm

:cry: your making me jealous
0

remus 
 

Re: instancing in indigo

Postby plot-paris » Fri Jun 20, 2008 11:49 am

I simplified the windows component a bit (reduced it from 16 to 5 faces) and tried a render again. now it worked perfectly fine with only 200 Mb Ram used by Indigo.

I even was able to place another building into the scene (which by itself is 20 times bigger in file size than the whole city).
granted, this twisted shape may look a bit alien in the otherwise orthogonal city. understand it as a symbol for SketchUp's unique and inovative workflow amidst loads of other applications with their narrow minded interfaces ;)


(in the model are 1910 buildings plus the twisted one)

this city is very basic: 5 different building heights (all based on the same storey component), assembled in 10 different block types.
just imagine, what wonderful and huge cities you can render if you put in a bit more time and effort to create variations...
0
User avatar
plot-paris 
 

Re: instancing in indigo

Postby Kenny » Fri Jun 20, 2008 5:23 pm

I tried the original model and it started loading but I got a run time error. I've got a pretty good spec too with 4GB Ram and a Core 2 duo E6850 processor.

Kenny
0

Kenny 
 

Re: instancing in indigo

Postby remus » Fri Jun 20, 2008 5:27 pm

I think a run time error is when it runs out of memory, not sure what would cause it though, if jakob can render it on his machine ;)
0

remus 
 

Re: instancing in indigo

Postby plot-paris » Mon Jun 23, 2008 3:08 pm

dear Kenny, thanks for trying out my model. I would very much like to see, what you can get out of it (for your pc seems to be quite capable ;) )

remus wrote:not sure what would cause it though, if jakob can render it on his machine ;)


well, I was only able to render the whole model after simplifying the windows...

here is that version (without the twisted building though - that is more than 4 Mb filesize)
city_simplified.skp
0
User avatar
plot-paris 
 

Re: instancing in indigo

Postby plot-paris » Tue Jun 24, 2008 8:33 am

and here another very quick one - 13 680 golden eggs (even with a cube as proxy very slow in SketchUp). quite fast to export though...
(thanks to OnSurface, JPP, ComponentSpray tools - model was set up in a second :) )



I hope to find the time to do something more fancy soon...
0
User avatar
plot-paris 
 

Re: instancing in indigo

Postby plot-paris » Tue Jul 15, 2008 2:03 pm

this image may not look very interesting. the only purpose was to test out polygon limits of indigo.

well, I am tempted to believe there are no limits :?

one of these forms has more than 55.000 polygons. in this scene I had almost 24.000 instances (low-res proxies in SketchUp, automatically replaced with the original by indigo).

that means, that indigo had to handle more than 1.3 Billion! polygons (1.300.000.000) :shock:

only 60 MB of ram were used by indigo for this very small image (exponentially more, when increasing the file size)...

0
User avatar
plot-paris 
 

Re: instancing in indigo

Postby chango70 » Tue Jul 15, 2008 2:08 pm

Would this work with Vray?
0

chango70 
 

Re: instancing in indigo

Postby ilay7k » Tue Jul 15, 2008 2:11 pm

no...only plans
0

ilay7k 
 

Re: instancing in indigo

Postby plot-paris » Tue Jul 15, 2008 2:52 pm

as far as I know, v-ray doesn't support instancing at present.

the most amazing tool about indigo in this case is not only that it allowes instancing, but that you can use a low-poly component as proxy in SketchUp, that are replaced with a high polygon component, when exported to indigo. otherwise you would have no chance to handle such a huge scene in SU...

I am not aware of any other render-engine, that does that. :?
0
User avatar
plot-paris 
 

Re: instancing in indigo

Postby Frederik » Tue Jul 15, 2008 3:10 pm

plot-paris wrote:as far as I know, v-ray doesn't support instancing at present.

Correct... ;)

plot-paris wrote:I am not aware of any other render-engine, that does that. :?

This is not correct... ;)
It's not that I want to hi-jack your thread, but I need to correct you since Kerkythea also supports instancing and you can use proxies in SU and replace these with instanced objects in KT... ;)

Please check out this thread, which is a small step-by-step tutorial I've posted at the KT Forum... ;)
0
Cheers
Kim Frederik
User avatar
Frederik 
Thea Render Support
Thea Render Support
 

Re: instancing in indigo

Postby Jon » Tue Jul 15, 2008 3:32 pm

Frederik wrote:Kerkythea also supports instancing and you can use proxies in SU and replace these with instanced objects in KT... ;)

In fact, Alex once did a test in KT involving a few billion polygons more than that. ;)
These are great tests, plot. Keep it up. :D
PS. I though Vue6 could export proxy objects :?:
Does anyone know for sure?
0
Jon
KT Team member

Jon 
 

Re: instancing in indigo

Postby solo » Tue Jul 15, 2008 3:49 pm

Vue 6 has instancing too.

okay...too slow you just mentioned it.
0
http://www.solos-art.com

If you see a toilet in your dreams do not use it.
User avatar
solo 
Global Moderator
 

Re: instancing in indigo

Postby plot-paris » Tue Jul 15, 2008 3:55 pm

ah, good to know, that there are biased renderers that support instancing as well. I just have to find the time to learn them :cry:

but please, post your tests here as well! I want to see loads and loads of instances :D
0
User avatar
plot-paris 
 

Re: instancing in indigo

Postby solo » Tue Jul 15, 2008 4:00 pm

I use Vue quite a lot these days for site overview renders, however I have not yet had the need for instancing, but that is about to change as I need to do an animation of a fly over in the near future that involves a very wooded area and I will need to familiarize myself with this feature soon. as soon As I figure it all out I will post an example and maybe a few screen grabs as to how it works.
If anyone out there is familiar with it and can assist my learning curve I would appreciate that ... Chipp I am looking at you. :D
0
http://www.solos-art.com

If you see a toilet in your dreams do not use it.
User avatar
solo 
Global Moderator
 

Re: instancing in indigo

Postby chango70 » Tue Jul 15, 2008 4:01 pm

Does anyone know which one of the other instancing renderer is fasster? Has anyone test the them before?
0

chango70 
 

Re: instancing in indigo

Postby solo » Tue Jul 15, 2008 6:29 pm

Okay!

That was very easy to figure out actually.
I used the Instancing brush in Vue 6 xstream to paint the SCF logo on a very uneven surface, it was extremely quick and smooth and rendered in 11 minutes.
I am impressed at the ease and simplicity of instancing with Vue.

0
http://www.solos-art.com

If you see a toilet in your dreams do not use it.
User avatar
solo 
Global Moderator
 

Re: instancing in indigo

Postby acatalyst » Tue Jul 15, 2008 7:19 pm

0

acatalyst 
 

Re: instancing in indigo

Postby solo » Tue Jul 15, 2008 8:03 pm

20 000 trees, 208 million polygons, render time 7m24s

0
http://www.solos-art.com

If you see a toilet in your dreams do not use it.
User avatar
solo 
Global Moderator
 

Re: instancing in indigo

Postby AdamB » Tue Jul 15, 2008 8:53 pm

Realtime instancing is the only way to go.. ;)

megacity.jpg


And a very short vid too is here

(Should just say that on my old laptop it runs at silky smooth 30Hz comfortably - its the vid capture/youtube compression that drops the framerate)

Adam
0
Last edited by AdamB on Tue Jul 15, 2008 9:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Developer of LightUp Click for website
User avatar
AdamB 
LightUp Support
LightUp Support
 

Re: instancing in indigo

Postby Frederik » Tue Jul 15, 2008 9:02 pm

Dang, Pete... You're smoking hot... :D
But that terraine would be impossible to orbit in SU... :(
I know zip about Vue, but how is your workflow..?? Do you import models from SU to Vue and take it from there, or...?!? :?

@Adam - can't see the video... :| Guess YouTube needs to get it through their verification system or something, so I will check it later... ;)

This is obviously a new plug-in/script you're working on - or.??
0
Cheers
Kim Frederik
User avatar
Frederik 
Thea Render Support
Thea Render Support
 

Re: instancing in indigo

Postby solo » Tue Jul 15, 2008 9:16 pm

Frederik,

I can model a component in SU and import straight into Vue6 xstream (it imports .skp) or I can use the tree/plant maker within the app, or use xfrog, onyx or tree generator trees and instance them. I can either duplicate, spread and smart drop them or I can paint them onto a terrain with the airbrush tool.
I can choose the scaling, assorted sizing, rotating and twisting too. I have collision control if I need it or allow overlapping, I have the fascillity to decrease the quality with distance leaving only the ones in the foreground in full detail.

Pretty cool.
0
http://www.solos-art.com

If you see a toilet in your dreams do not use it.
User avatar
solo 
Global Moderator
 

SketchUcation One-Liner Adverts

by Ad Machine » 5 minutes ago



Ad Machine 
Robot
 

Next


 

Return to Gallery

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests

Visit our sponsors: