Blown Away

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Re: Blown Away

Postby JQL » Tue Feb 02, 2016 10:47 pm

Yup what's enervating about UE is that it's all realtime...
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Re: Blown Away

Postby pbacot » Wed Feb 03, 2016 1:20 am

Off-Topic:
en·er·vat·ing
ˈenərˌvādiNG/
adjective
adjective: enervating

causing one to feel drained of energy or vitality.
"the enervating humidity of the coast"


Origin
early 17th century: from Latin enervat- ‘weakened (by extraction of the sinews),’

How the Romans came up with this who knows, but they did get pretty "medieval" before it was medieval.
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Re: Blown Away

Postby cuttingedge » Wed Feb 03, 2016 5:11 am

JQL wrote:Cutting edge, why are you looking at what others did. Download the trial and try it yourself.



I probably will soon, It so happened that ValeroStudio , along with Nomeradona were my 'mentors' in vrayfor SU.

The reason why I even bother giving anything a try is somebody I look up to recommend it. Its not easy to shift, unlearn, relearn: all about learning curve ya know. One of the convincing force to me now is Solo. - :fro:

If Peter Guthrie, Bertrand Benoit would recommend something and show some 'real stuff' which I can actually afford. It will be worth trying it without questions. :)
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Re: Blown Away

Postby JQL » Wed Feb 03, 2016 11:04 am

Well... having references to look up to is great.

Waiting for their decisions to influence what you do is not thinking straight imho.

If they are confortable with vray and 3ds why would they change?

I wouldn't do it if I were them...

If you are confortable with vray and sketchup, why would you think of changing?

I also wouldn't do it if I were you...

Thea is a hell of a software, but it's not as mature as Vray. The thing where it's better is at it's core. I have very little questions about it as Biased and Unbiased, GPU+CPU are no match for anything else. We can question if others are as fast, and probably there are some that are (I doubt it...)

But I can't tell much about it as I'm basically using thea and that's it. I've also been using nvidia's Iray (integrated in software) that you would think would be the best engine for GPU as it's from the actual manufacturer of the GPU's itself, and it's no match for Thea.

However Thea is young and all these engines are an huge undertaking. It's in the "Cuttingedge" on that, but there are a very few features that are still lacking.

So, if those features are the ones you miss then Thea might not be for you (yet). However I doubt you miss those features as you're using sketchup!

So, if you're mainly into archviz (and you should as you're talking of BB and Guthrie) and using Sketchup, T4SU is "THE" software to use.

Try asking Bertrand Benoit or Peter Guthrie wich Renderer would they use in Sketchup and they probably would ask you back - Why the Hell would I render in Sketchup?
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Re: Blown Away

Postby JQL » Wed Feb 03, 2016 11:12 am

pbacot wrote: causing one to feel drained of energy or vitality.


pbacot, thanks for clarifying it, though I'm not an native english speaker, that was what I meant.

It's incredible how that guy (and others) are capable of such realistic rendering in realtime, with those engines, while we are striving for realism using physically accurate ray tracers and most of us still can't.

I know that we are doing a lot of stuff and not only rendering, I also know that everyone that starts thinks that they will buy a Physically Based renderer and that will turn their simple models into photos with a click of a button while the reality is completelly different.

Imagine how far I am from achieving that when a couple of years ago I thought I was going to buy a renderer and push a button to get a photo.
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Re: Blown Away

Postby valerostudio » Wed Feb 03, 2016 11:56 am

My testimonial right now is this -

I was sick of long parsing times, I needed an interactive real-time solution that worked and allowed me to make quick artistic decisions, I needed HQ clean fast output for those quick jobs where i need 10 images in an hour for a meeting, I needed a simple clean UI with a simple material editor with'shortcuts' to trim down the time I was spending making materials. Lastly, I needed an engine that did what I wanted when I needed it. Give it a spin, make your own conclusions.
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Re: Blown Away

Postby Hieru » Wed Feb 03, 2016 12:18 pm

JQL wrote:Waiting for their decisions to influence what you do is not thinking straight imho.


I agree. Everyone gets on with render engines differently...so whilst big name artists may do fine with something like Vray, things might not click into place for you personally. That's what it was like for me when I first looked for rendering software and tried most of the big name engines.

When I tried Thea everything made much more sense to me and it was both easier and quicker to get the results I wanted...and that was way back when it was first in public Beta.

JQL wrote:If they are comfortable with vray and 3ds why would they change?


As it happens both BB & Guthrie do experiment with new render engines - Corona being a good example. Only yesterday I watched an interview with Peter Guthrie and Henry Goss, where they talked about keeping an eye on cutting edge technology and being in the process of trying out new rendering software. For all we know, they could be auditioning Thea as we speak.
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Re: Blown Away

Postby JQL » Wed Feb 03, 2016 12:33 pm

Hieru wrote:
JQL wrote:If they are comfortable with vray and 3ds why would they change?


As it happens both BB & Guthrie do experiment with new render engines - Corona being a good example. Only yesterday I watched an interview with Peter Guthrie and Henry Goss, where they talked about keeping an eye on cutting edge technology and being in the process of trying out new rendering software. For all we know, they could be auditioning Thea as wee speak.


I happen to also viewed that interview before I made my statement so I knew that was the answer already... I just wasn't expecting it would be you who'd give the answer...

They do experiment other engines and software, if they fall back to Vray or move on, is something we won't know soon until something big hits our screen.

I also saw Peter Guthrie's take on Corona a while back and I think I saw something of the likes from BB.

They clearly state stuff about Unreal Engine, but I guess that's because of Koola's achievements.

Really, users are thrown by what others can do with software.

If they've ever tried Thea I don't know, but I'm pretty confident they will, sooner or later.

I guess that should depend on Thea for 3ds integration wich I think it's still not as developed as Corona's.
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Re: Blown Away

Postby jiminy-billy-bob » Wed Feb 03, 2016 12:47 pm

JQL wrote:I guess that should depend on Thea for 3ds integration wich I think it's still not as developed as Corona's.

Thea's 3dsmax integration is terrible. It doesn't use any UI/UX default elements from 3dsmax, it adds its own. Like the material editor: We can only use Thea's seperate editor. It makes sense on SU, because there is nothing to work on as a base, but on max it's a terrible idea.

The engine can be as good as you want, if the integration is not good, it will never take off.
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Re: Blown Away

Postby Hieru » Wed Feb 03, 2016 12:56 pm

JQL wrote:Really, users are thrown by what others can do with software.


Which is why the likes of Corona give away free licenses to artists such as BB & Guthrie and then hype up their involvement. They know that kind of marketing works.

It's similar with Vray to an extent and as a result it's rare that artists will try any other render engines when starting out. New users are always asking where they can download Vray (usually meaning a cracked version), or find tutorials. It doesn't even occur to them to try out what else is available.
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Re: Blown Away

Postby Hieru » Wed Feb 03, 2016 1:01 pm

jiminy-billy-bob wrote:Thea's 3dsmax integration is terrible. It doesn't use any UI/UX default elements from 3dsmax, it adds its own. Like the material editor: We can only use Thea's seperate editor. It makes sense on SU, because there is nothing to work on as a base, but on max it's a terrible idea.

The engine can be as good as you want, if the integration is not good, it will never take off.

I suppose it depends on your Workflow and past experience. As a long time Thea and Sketchup user, if I moved to using 3dsmax for modelling then I would probably want the Thea material interface to work as you describe it. Having to use Thea through 3dsmax's native material system would likely be a real pain for me.
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Re: Blown Away

Postby jiminy-billy-bob » Wed Feb 03, 2016 2:09 pm

Sure, but you can't expect 3dsmax users to re-learn everything.
Vray and Corona have great success because they are very well integrated in 3dsmax. This is not the case of Thea, and I think that's why it never took off on that platform.

(That said, I love Thea4SU)
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Re: Blown Away

Postby Hieru » Wed Feb 03, 2016 2:50 pm

If that's the case, I think it would be worthwhile the Thea devs having a rethink when it comes to 3dsmax.I suppose that Thea support for 3dsmax plugins would also be a big selling point.

Users like myself are in the minority and I would always have the option of modelling in 3dsmax and then moving to Thea Studio for working on materials etc - which is what I used to do before Thea4SU took a huge leap forward in it's development.
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Re: Blown Away

Postby valerostudio » Wed Feb 03, 2016 3:06 pm

I am using Thea now for the same reason I chose to use SketchUp over Rhino or Max. Speed. More often than not, I have a couple of days at most to design, model, render, deliver.
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Re: Blown Away

Postby jiminy-billy-bob » Wed Feb 03, 2016 3:14 pm

Hieru wrote:If that's the case, I think it would be worthwhile the Thea devs having a rethink when it comes to 3dsmax.

They're aware of this.
That's an issue I've discussed with them at last year's and this year's DevCamps.
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Re: Blown Away

Postby JQL » Wed Feb 03, 2016 6:48 pm

We definetelly need 3ds users under our roof.

That would benefit Thea and in consequence T4SU too.
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Re: Blown Away

Postby cuttingedge » Wed Feb 03, 2016 7:30 pm

valerostudio wrote:My testimonial right now is this -

I was sick of long parsing times, I needed an interactive real-time solution that worked and allowed me to make quick artistic decisions, I needed HQ clean fast output for those quick jobs where i need 10 images in an hour for a meeting,



I need that too! The Office where I work clamor for that. Yes a good balance of Speed and quality with now more weight to Speed! ArchViz is what I do. The competition is tight in the industry that we cant compromise quality.

I hope you dont mind showing me an example of a "good balance" you are achieving with Thea.. even outside of this forum. I'd truly appreciate..
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Re: Blown Away

Postby Pixero » Wed Feb 03, 2016 8:03 pm

Here is a link to an image I made as a hobby project.
viewtopic.php?f=81&t=59221

If I remember correct it was rendered at 3000 pixels on my laptop with a mediocre GPU in less than an hour.
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Re: Blown Away

Postby JQL » Wed Feb 03, 2016 9:53 pm

I had a day with the kids at my parents and I wanted an excuse to test all the skatter features I could.

Modeled on a saturday morning, played with skatter after lunch while placing trees proxies with interactive rendering. At night I prepared a batch render on 3 scenes and in the next morning the 3 were finished.







This is the console log:

Thea for SketchUp 1.5.04.376.1413 x64
Loaded from: C:/ProgramData/SketchUp/SketchUp 2016/SketchUp/Plugins/Thea4SU_files/
Auto-Save enabled.
Session folder: C:/Temp/Session_00000077
Data collected in: 10s
Device #0: GeForce GTX TITAN X
Building Environment... Note: activating instancing mode for saving memory.
done. (1.887 seconds)
- Polys: 510672841, Objects: 268412, Parametric: 0
- Moving: 0, Displaced: 0, Clipped: 1739
- Instances: 268185, Portals: 0
- Nodes: 3849775, Leaves: 3811477, Cache Level: Normal
Warming Up... done. (0.747 seconds)
Device #1: Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-5820K CPU @ 3.30GHz
Device #1: memory 3248/12080/32663 Mb
Device #0: memory 3045/6722/12288 Mb
Device #1: 2x4 s/p
Device #0: 3x4 s/p
Finished in 4 minutes and 17 seconds!


This how an image was after ~3 min hitting render button with Presto MC (Presto AO is faster).

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Re: Blown Away

Postby AcesHigh » Thu Feb 18, 2016 1:46 pm

JQL wrote:Unreal Engine master is this one:

https://www.youtube.com/user/koooolalala



check out these guys from Brazil






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