3D Truss Models

Re: 3D Truss Models

Postby medeek » Thu Jan 28, 2016 9:11 am

I've uploaded a test L-Shaped structure with a hip roof:

https://3dwarehouse.sketchup.com/model. ... ba849765bb

I've created both hip roof primitives with the plugin, that was the easy part.

I then placed a valley rafter with its centerline (top) inline with both roof planes. I think I've got it right. What I am unsure of however is the best way to terminate the framing at the intersection of the valley, lower ridge and flying hip. Once I have a handle on how a carpenter would actually construct that junction I think I can proceed to start work on a secondary roof module for both hip and gable rafter roofs.
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Re: 3D Truss Models

Postby medeek » Thu Jan 28, 2016 5:27 pm

One method of framing this roof configuration is to extend the lower ridge past the joint until it meets the next jack rafter, then the flying hip and valley are miter cut to meet the lower ridge.

I've created a version of the model above with this method of framing at the flying hip/valley/ridge joint:



https://3dwarehouse.sketchup.com/model. ... 9fd2b63705

What is the thinking on this method of framing this particular configuration?

My other concern is the way I have the valley rafter miter cut where it meets the fascia and the corner of the building wall (top plate). Is there a more practical way or better way of making those cuts?
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Last edited by medeek on Fri Jan 29, 2016 6:20 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 3D Truss Models

Postby medeek » Thu Jan 28, 2016 6:41 pm

Compare Rev 2 with Rev 3:



https://3dwarehouse.sketchup.com/model. ... 988684289e

This version of Hip Roof 4 has the flying hip extending as a full hip to the exterior wall and then the lower ridge framing into it with the valley rafter framed in last.
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Last edited by medeek on Fri Jan 29, 2016 6:40 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 3D Truss Models

Postby medeek » Thu Jan 28, 2016 11:41 pm

Rev. 5 is a slight variation of the previous roofs. I have shifted the secondary roof over by 24" to create a T-shaped building. The question is how to best frame the long and short valleys:

https://3dwarehouse.sketchup.com/model. ... ac12b6da21
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Re: 3D Truss Models

Postby medeek » Fri Jan 29, 2016 7:03 pm

The intersection of the supporting valley rafter, valley rafter and lower ridge I had framed incorrectly. The corrected method is shown below:



Also note that the segment of the supporting valley rafter between the upper ridge and lower ridge would need to be beveled or "backed" otherwise it clashes with the sheathing. I noticed this when I originally added the supporting valley rafter but confirmed my suspicion when perusing DeWalt's carpentry and framing handbook this morning. I probably should have pulled this book out before beginning this study but it only confirmed everything I had managed to discover myself once I started examining the model.
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Re: 3D Truss Models

Postby medeek » Sat Jan 30, 2016 6:17 am

Now that I've got a gable and hip rafter roof I was thinking about adding in a dutch gable roof, but I'm a little unclear on the best method to support the end rafters. Has anyone ever seen something like this used?



I've checked all of my carpentry and construction books and there is absolutely no reference material on traditional framing of this type of roof, online is also quite scant, any resources, framing diagrams etc... would be quite helpful.
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Re: 3D Truss Models

Postby medeek » Sat Jan 30, 2016 8:00 am

This is my first crack at a dutch gable roof framed with rafters:



Without the sheathing:



Please examine the model here:

https://3dwarehouse.sketchup.com/model. ... 244d958750
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Re: 3D Truss Models

Postby medeek » Sat Jan 30, 2016 10:54 pm

Dutch Gable Rev. 2:

https://3dwarehouse.sketchup.com/model. ... 726b281151

Same as previous except for doubled up common rafters at dutch gable.
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Re: 3D Truss Models

Postby medeek » Sun Jan 31, 2016 2:31 am

Dutch Gable Rev. 3:

Doubled up gable common rafters with the dutch ridge/ledger is sandwiched between them. Found a paper by Larry Haun, Mar. 1995 "Framing a Dutch Roof" that was published in Fine Homebuilding magazine, that describes a very similar method of framing.



View model here:

https://3dwarehouse.sketchup.com/model. ... 0b6b0852a8

Disregard the common rafter sizes they are undersized but look at the method of sandwiching the dutch ridge/ledger between the last common rafters. I would probably also install some blocking between the double gable common rafters. I'm also not showing all of the ceiling joists and bird blocking etc...

If the roof gets large enough then one could go to a double ply dutch ridge, or even a deeper LVL member, assuming there is no internal support available from internal walls.

I think I'm now ready to add the dutch gable roof into the plugin.
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Re: 3D Truss Models

Postby pbacot » Sun Jan 31, 2016 3:05 am

That looks like a nice way to do it!
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Re: 3D Truss Models

Postby medeek » Sun Jan 31, 2016 4:27 am

There is more than one way to skin a cat with this stuff but if I'm going to put something out there I want it to conform as best as possible to current construction methods. Some of these details may be above and beyond what is required but this is the stuff that keeps me up a night.
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Re: 3D Truss Models

Postby medeek » Sun Jan 31, 2016 6:30 am

I've also realized that for hip roofs I need an option to set the depth of the hip rafters since they are often larger members than the common or jack rafters.

Here is the new icon for secondary roofs:



This category will contain the following items:

- Gable Roof Minor
- Hip Roof Minor
- Dutch Gable Roof Minor
- Gable Dormer
- Hip Dormer
- Shed Dormer
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Re: 3D Truss Models

Postby medeek » Tue Feb 02, 2016 10:24 am

Version 1.2.8 - 02.02.2015
- Added Shed Rafter Roof with Ledger (all advanced options enabled).
- Added ceiling joist option for Shed Rafter Roofs.
- New submenu item and toolbar icon added for secondary (minor) roofs.



View model here:

https://3dwarehouse.sketchup.com/model. ... 7a2db95199

I used this option to create a monitor style roof line but it can also be used for porch roofs, carports etc... I still need to add a standard shed roof with and upper and lower birdsmouth cut.

Also note that with both gable and shed roofs the ceiling joist option is available, with the option to raise them above the top plate. In this model the shed roof ceiling joists are raised 6 inches.
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Re: 3D Truss Models

Postby pbacot » Tue Feb 02, 2016 5:23 pm

Looks nice!
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Re: 3D Truss Models

Postby medeek » Wed Feb 03, 2016 12:14 am

I've created a listing in the SketchUcation PluginStore:

http://sketchucation.com/pluginstore?pl ... USS_PLUGIN
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Re: 3D Truss Models

Postby medeek » Wed Feb 03, 2016 1:37 am

More "Fun with Roofs".

This roof was generated by first creating a hip roof primitive then deleting all but 3 components which were then copied and rotated into place for the lower roof hip corner. The shed roof /w ledger component was created with one primitive and then copied and rotated into place. Overall a fairly painless process now that I am somewhat familiar with navigating my way around SketchUp. The fascia required a couple of trims.

The pyramid at the top required no manual intervention. Approximately 10-15 minutes of work for a fairly substantial roof.



View model here:

https://3dwarehouse.sketchup.com/model. ... 5dee4e2519
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Re: 3D Truss Models

Postby medeek » Thu Feb 04, 2016 5:02 am

Testing the real world application of the Medeek Truss Plugin. This model combines a double fink truss, raised heel fink truss, monopitch truss and shed roof with ledger. While creating the shed roof special attention to the birdsmouth cut was required to ensure that the fascia height of the rafters and trusses lined up. Also note the use of the raised heel type truss on the upper roof portion. Structural outlookers were specified for all gable overhangs.

5:12 pitch roofs with rafters and trusses 24" o/c. I did not apply a level cut to the rafter overhangs but that would probably be a given. Span of the double fink is 48 feet with 2x6 top and bottom chords.





View models here:

https://3dwarehouse.sketchup.com/model. ... aefca9b941

https://3dwarehouse.sketchup.com/model. ... a8c10c99a9

If anyone has some real world applications using the plugin that they are willing to share I would be very interested to see how it is being used and it would also give me some direction for further development and improvements.
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Re: 3D Truss Models

Postby pilou » Thu Feb 04, 2016 11:11 am

What a plugin! :fro:

Sorry for the diversion! ;)
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Re: 3D Truss Models

Postby medeek » Thu Feb 04, 2016 6:33 pm

I've ran into this structural question before, where you have a stairway next to an exterior wall. My first thought is to call out a balloon framed wall up to the 2nd story top plate(s) but then that makes the rim board and double top plate of the first story discontinuous. What is the preferred solution or how have you seen this done in similar circumstances.

Here is a quick mock up in SketchUp to better explain what the two options are:





You can also view and download the 3D SketchUp model here:

https://3dwarehouse.sketchup.com/model. ... d20b64d313
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Re: 3D Truss Models

Postby juju » Fri Feb 05, 2016 12:42 pm

Hi Nathaniel,

I noticed that Extension Warehouse has two links for your plugin, the one should be removed, not so?

http://extensions.sketchup.com/en/conte ... uss-plugin

http://extensions.sketchup.com/en/conte ... s-plugin-0
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Re: 3D Truss Models

Postby medeek » Fri Feb 05, 2016 5:35 pm

For some reason there are two copies on Extension Warehouse, you're right. I'm looking into it.
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Re: 3D Truss Models

Postby medeek » Fri Feb 05, 2016 8:26 pm

Example of a porch roof using the hip roof and shed roof primitives. I'm wondering if it might not be worthwhile to add in a feature to create this type of combination roof automatically. Shed Roof w/ ledger & hip ends.



View updated model here:

https://3dwarehouse.sketchup.com/model. ... d20b64d313
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Re: 3D Truss Models

Postby pbacot » Sat Feb 06, 2016 12:10 am

Both shed and hip add-on roofs would be useful, porches and partial 2-story structures.
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Re: 3D Truss Models

Postby medeek » Sun Feb 07, 2016 11:08 am

Started the manual as a MS Word document however that doesn't work so well for hyperlinks. Starting over with an html manual page:

http://design.medeek.com/support/trussp ... npage.html

http://design.medeek.com/support/trussp ... truss.html

Couple of pages up, only about 25 more to go...
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Last edited by medeek on Mon Feb 08, 2016 9:00 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 3D Truss Models

Postby medeek » Mon Feb 08, 2016 12:36 am

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Re: 3D Truss Models

Postby medeek » Sat Feb 13, 2016 7:59 am

Version 1.2.9 - 02.12.2015
- Added Shed Rafter Roof (all advanced options enabled).
- Added ceiling joist option for Shed Rafter Roofs.
- Initial menu now defaults to last picked option of session for that sub-menu item.

A typical application might be a clerestory roof with a upper shed roof and lower shed roof with a ledger board:



View model here:

https://3dwarehouse.sketchup.com/model.html?id=u0b2dd5bc-605d-467c-a6bb-449bb54e76e6
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Re: 3D Truss Models

Postby medeek » Sun Feb 14, 2016 3:20 pm

Version 1.3.0 - 02.14.2016
- Added tail bearing truss type, configurations: (Fink).
- Metric input enabled for tail bearing truss type.
- Advanced options enabled for tail bearing truss type.



View model here:

https://3dwarehouse.sketchup.com/model. ... 691f31cca7

I have shown 3 configurations of the same roof to display the differences with non-structural vs. structural outlookers (horz. & vert.). I am not exactly sure how to treat the gable end truss for this truss type since I have never dealt with this type of truss before. Specifically, where structural outlookers are employed. Any sample outputs showing the gable end truss with a dropped top chord for a tail bearing truss would be very helpful.

Theoretically, one could forego the gable end trusses altogether and just balloon frame up to the roof diaphragm but I would like to provide the option for gable end trusses if it is a typical method used in real construction of this type of roof.
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Re: 3D Truss Models

Postby medeek » Mon Feb 15, 2016 12:55 am

I am currently investigating the best method to construct the gable end wall and truss with a tail bearing truss. Show below are 3 different possible configurations:


1.) Structural Outlookers (Vertical)


2.) Non-Structural Outlookers (Horizontal)


3.) Structural Outlookers (Horizontal)

This is just one possible method of framing the gable end wall into the gable truss with a 2x4 outlooker. Option 3 shown above is somewhat of a question, not sure how that heel joint would come together.

View the model here to analyze the different configurations:

https://3dwarehouse.sketchup.com/model.html?id=u75c42456-c8e5-4002-bc93-779860f8dc61
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Re: 3D Truss Models

Postby medeek » Mon Feb 15, 2016 3:55 am

Alternatively one could balloon frame the wall at the gable ends and attach a ledger for the ceiling:



View model here:

https://3dwarehouse.sketchup.com/model. ... fd128b5913

In my opinion a partially sloping wall gets complicated to frame. From an engineering standpoint the balloon framed wall is also the strongest option.

This method of framing the gable end wall may make the most sense. I'm trying to form a consensus though on the best way to frame this so that users of the plugin are presented with adequate options that cover 90% or better of design situations they will come across in practice.

For those of you who are particularly interested in the the tail bearing truss please weigh in and let me know which option(s) works best for you.
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Re: 3D Truss Models

Postby medeek » Tue Feb 16, 2016 10:53 am

Version 1.3.1 - 02.15.2016
- Added Triple Fink and Quad Fink common truss types.
- Structural outlookers (vert. & horz.) enabled under advanced roof options for Common (Triple & Quad Fink) truss types.


Triple Fink @ 70' w/ 2x6 chords
Quad Fink @ 80' w/ 2x6 chords

View model here:

https://3dwarehouse.sketchup.com/model. ... 89940c94b2
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