Vray scatter

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Vray scatter

Postby solo » Tue Jun 02, 2009 6:39 pm

New release, for Vray and 3DMax only, wow!!!

http://www.vray.com/news/2009/02/21/vra ... -released/
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Re: Vray scatter

Postby thomthom » Tue Jun 02, 2009 6:55 pm

While we are on the topic of V-Ray: http://software.asgvis.com/index.php?op ... Itemid=493
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Re: Vray scatter

Postby kwistenbiebel » Tue Jun 02, 2009 7:05 pm

I think it's time to learn Max.
Vray for Max seems much more advanced than current VrayforSU.
Apparently it will take more than a year for a new VfSU release and I can't imagine they will implement some of the scatter or realtime stuff...

By the way, Asgvis seems to become reseller of other products besides their own, as well as being a render studio (competing with their own customers?) ...
I find that a bit strange. It appears to me they don't really foresee a great future for their own products (vrayforRhino/Sketchup), betting on two horses like that...
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Re: Vray scatter

Postby thomthom » Tue Jun 02, 2009 8:11 pm

kwistenbiebel wrote:I think it's time to learn Max.
Vray for Max seems much more advanced than current VrayforSU.
Apparently it will take more than a year for a new VfSU release and I can't imagine they will implement some of the scatter or realtime stuff...

Well, V-Ray plugin that relies on the SDK will be behind on V-Ray for Max.
As for scatter, for SU's use I think Component spray works fine. That combined with VfSU2's proxy. Won't be able to handle scenes like Max, but this is SU we're talking about after all.

kwistenbiebel wrote:By the way, Asgvis seems to become reseller of other products besides their own, as well as being a render studio (competing with their own customers?) ...
I find that a bit strange. It appears to me they don't really foresee a great future for their own products (vrayforRhino/Sketchup), betting on two horses like that...

Sounds like a sensible plan to ensure income from different sources. Makes it easier to survive times like this.
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Re: Vray scatter

Postby dalomar » Tue Jun 02, 2009 9:52 pm

kwistenbiebel wrote:By the way, Asgvis seems to become reseller of other products besides their own


We got a lot of requests from studios that use V-Ray on more than one platform that they would like to buy from one place for everything V-Ray as opposed to one place per V-Ray platform. That's a measure to accommodate them.

as well as being a render studio (competing with their own customers?) ...


We were actually a rendering studio for longer than we've been developing software. While still a studio we brought in a programmer to help streamline some of our Max/V-Ray pipeline. We began getting involved with the ChaosGroup and moved on to developing V-Ray for Rhino and SU. From there things on the software side have grown so much, all the time the rendering studio still plugging away, producing top notch visualizations.

We don't really see it as competing with our own customers (V-Ray for Rhino/SU at least) since the main target of our visualization services are very high quality stills and animations. Although we do have some users of our software that do high end visualization, the majority of our users are designers who pair visualization with their design process. The imagery that our studio produces requires the focus, knowledge, and experience of a visualization professional, which is something that not every one is has the time, effort, or money to do on their own. Take a look at the Four Seasons or Silo Point projects in the Services gallery...are you going to hire a helicopter to fly over Baltimore's Inner Harbor? Our visualization studio will go to those lengths to get the shots. Hopefully that explains things a little more

I find that a bit strange. It appears to me they don't really foresee a great future for their own products (vrayforRhino/Sketchup), betting on two horses like that...


Well, we really don't. We're trying to provide for our customers, whatever they need, whether its a seat of V-Ray (for whatever app you may be using) or a top quality animation. Besides, the more successful we are as a company, the more we can improve V-Ray for SU and V-Ray for Rhino
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Re: Vray scatter

Postby solo » Tue Jun 02, 2009 10:06 pm

The more I look at it the more I believe vray needs to go studio, importing from SU and being able to import proxies, xfrog, other models, etc, like Thea is going to be. That way we can still use SU to a point then compile in Vray when we saturate SU's polys. Unfortunately right now Vray4su is limitted to SU ability to create a scene.

I use Vue for this exact reason, but frankly prefer vray for rendering, thus I need to buy the Max version of Vray in order to be able to model the basics in SU, populate the ecosystem in Vue as well as add real atmospheres, then with Vue's new integration with Max and Vray4max I can render it in Max using Vray.

Here is an idea of Vue's 'scatter' (ecosystem) notice the polygon count.



I added smoke, animated sky and changed the view to % resourses available, see with over a million trees, five and a half billion polys, I'm still have 86% resources left and I have SU open as well as many IE windows.
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Re: Vray scatter

Postby dalomar » Tue Jun 02, 2009 10:07 pm

I completely missed the scatter stuff :)

The main component to V-Ray scatter is getting V-Ray proxies in to VfSU, which is right at the top of the list for the next full version of VfSU. After that, the "scattering" is a matter of placing the objects on surfaces with a random rotation/scale transform. In that basic sense, this is something that I would like to have available natively in VfSU, but I will know more as we get int proxy development. As a note, V-Ray proxies will most likely be very tied into SU components, so any script that randomly places, rotates, scales a component will likely work well with proxies piggy backing on top of it.
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Re: Vray scatter

Postby kwistenbiebel » Wed Jun 03, 2009 12:58 am

Hi Damien (Dalomar),

An apology from my part is in place.... Your reasoning sounds reasonable :)
Actually I DO like VrayforSketchup, even though I am starting to miss some options the Max/C4D version has. Mostly the directional/sphere lights etc.


Hi Pete (Solo),

To be honest I like the idea of a render engine to be nested within SU itself.
I used to work with Maxwell but I got a headache from the fact that the workflow is killed when you need to alter your design in depth after having setup everything in the studio. A hassle.
The beauty of a render engine within SU is that it makes changes to the model easier to do without having to change all the setup.
Off course Sketchup does have a lot of shortcomings (polycount, etc...) which speaks in favour of having a seperate studio.... difficult one.

BTW, those Vue images always astonish me. Great work!
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Re: Vray scatter

Postby EarthMover » Wed Jun 03, 2009 1:17 am

Vray Studio would be great. I doubt it will ever happen. Vray has managed to make it's users continue to pay for the same engine on different platforms. Studio based render engines, i.e. Fry, maxwell, artlantis sell the software once with a plugin extension for most 3D programs included. If I own 3ds max and sketchup and I want to use Vray on both, I need to shell out cash twice. To use Fryrender on both platforms is just a matter of dropping a plugin and exporter into the program of my choice.

The perks of a vray studio would be the ability to use all of the capabilities of vray, even if your modeling software is not so capable of supporting those functions.
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Re: Vray scatter

Postby dalomar » Wed Jun 03, 2009 2:39 pm

No worries Kwisten. I think people don't realize that software isn't the only side of our business, so once you realize how much those other parts actually contribute to ASGvis as a company it does make a little more sense. I know that you're waiting for more from VfSU, and we want to get to being as on par with VfMax as we can. We have the opportunity to do so with the current state of the V-Ray SDK and the new overhaul of the Core will only make it easier for us to add the features we need.

As to a V-Ray studio, that's something that's in the ChaosGroup's ballpark, not ours, and something that they really don't have too much of a interest in. Even if down the road, the different V-Ray plugins wind up relying on rendering through the V-Ray StandAlone (which is pretty much a commandline renderer at this point), it will be the responsibility of each of the plugins to generate the appropriate scene file and there really wouldn't be much of a chance to modify or adjust that scene before it would get rendering through the standalone.
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