Select Perimeter Edges only

Select Perimeter Edges only

Postby JClements » Tue Jun 30, 2009 4:13 pm

A few years ago a script was created to select perimeter/outer edges only.

I'm not sure why but it doesn't work quite the same now (perhaps because of program changes to SU)?

Can a script be written to handle the two extremes examples shown here?

Perimeter (outer) Edges only.jpg


Perimeter (outer) Edges only 2.jpg
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Re: Select Perimeter Edges only

Postby Chris Fullmer » Tue Jun 30, 2009 6:06 pm

John, how do you see it working.

Dose the user have to completely select the object on their own?

Or should they be able to just select a single face/edge and the script will find everything that connects to that and determine if its a perimeter edge.

Benefits of #1 is that you can narrow the selected permiter lines down to be only within what the user selected first. Downside is that the script only looks through what is selected. So hidden lines could get skipped.

Benefits of #2 is its faster to be able to just select a single face/edge and run the plugin. Downside is that there is no way to let user control how much of the object to process. The script will just look at all connected entities (which really is probably just fine in most cases).

What do you think? I already have version 1 written and done. But then I thought about version 2 perhaps being better?

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Re: Select Perimeter Edges only

Postby pilou » Tue Jun 30, 2009 6:56 pm

exist ouliner.rb
Seems works with all version
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Re: Select Perimeter Edges only

Postby JClements » Tue Jun 30, 2009 7:07 pm

Chris, thanks for replying.

My initial feeling is method #1. And if the user triple-clicked the hidden edges would be get select anyway and they could then run the script, correct?

I hadn't really considered method #2, if its a no-brainer to script then I suppose we could pick and choose between the two by installing both or either one.
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Re: Select Perimeter Edges only

Postby solo » Tue Jun 30, 2009 7:16 pm

No ruby's needed.

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Re: Select Perimeter Edges only

Postby Chris Fullmer » Tue Jun 30, 2009 7:23 pm

Yes, but that only works so smoothly when you can smooth your entire object like you did. Imagine an object where you have certain things smoothed for a reason, and other edges left hard. Then that way doesn't quite work. (though quite frankly that rarely/never happens in my workflow, and I also preyy much don't ever need to select all the outer edges, so the ruby script is not one I find useful). But it only took about 5 minutes to write, and much of that was copying and adjusting the menu system and the legal mumbo jumbo.

Anyhow, I'll post a working version in a minute John.

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Re: Select Perimeter Edges only

Postby •BTM » Tue Jun 30, 2009 7:31 pm

Pete's way can work with specifically unsoftened areas too; just do it inside the group, and when the edges are selected, hit undo :)
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Re: Select Perimeter Edges only

Postby Chris Fullmer » Tue Jun 30, 2009 7:56 pm

+1 for BTM

but I still posted the little ruby here:

viewtopic.php?f=180&t=20274

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Re: Select Perimeter Edges only

Postby JClements » Tue Jun 30, 2009 8:52 pm

Thanks, Chris!

When the script is needed (although it may not be often) it will be greatly appreciated ... usually after doing deformations + plus mulitiple intersections, odd shapes, etc., which seems like its always at the end of the day, near a deadline, and you don't time and are impatient :) )

It worked pretty well on this one (which is a result of a projection) but not quite. Anyway it will work I think for a majority of cases :thumb: . Thanks again for sharing.

John

P.S. At least keep it alive in your archives.
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Re: Select Perimeter Edges only

Postby Chris Fullmer » Tue Jun 30, 2009 9:54 pm

Wow John, how can you work like that? Where's your axis? That model was very weird to try and orient with the axis off and no prior knowledge of what should be up or down.

anyhow, I turned on the axis and I was able to figure it out :)

As for the script not working right, that is actually because the model is a little off. Its not perfectly flat.

EDIT: Not that a model has to be flat for my plugin to work. But in this case, there are overlaps that apear to be flat, which are not flat. So the plugin selects edges that don't look like outer edges, but in fact are since they are not flat with the faces that are overlapping them.

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Re: Select Perimeter Edges only

Postby pilou » Tue Jun 30, 2009 10:15 pm

Seems that is a 2D view of a 3D work ;)
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Re: Select Perimeter Edges only

Postby JClements » Tue Jun 30, 2009 10:33 pm

Chris, I only turned of the axis so they wouldn't show when I exported a jpg :)
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Re: Select Perimeter Edges only

Postby mitcorb » Wed Jul 01, 2009 12:08 am

this starts to suggest selection of loops, maybe creation of loops, maybe loop subdivide on volumetric models, not just planar objects.
never mind-- just a tangential rambling
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Re: Select Perimeter Edges only

Postby modelhead » Wed Jul 01, 2009 2:10 am

Summary;
:enlight: ............. :roll: ........... :? ............ :oops: ............. :puke:
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Re: Select Perimeter Edges only

Postby Chris Fullmer » Wed Jul 01, 2009 2:36 am

mitcorb wrote:this starts to suggest selection of loops, maybe creation of loops, maybe loop subdivide on volumetric models, not just planar objects.
never mind-- just a tangential rambling

Doesn't Thom have some selection toys that work with loops? Thom, I've looked at your script, but I've forgotten which it is and what exactly it does. Want to step in and enlighten us?

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Re: Select Perimeter Edges only

Postby Chris Fullmer » Wed Jul 01, 2009 2:39 am

Well, here's his selection tools plugin:

viewtopic.php?f=180&t=14975&p=114380&hilit=%5BPlugin%5D#p114380

It does have select loop. Its not something I've gotten the hang of in other modelers, so I'd have a hard time implementing it. But check out Thom's, looks like it should work for loops!

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Re: Select Perimeter Edges only

Postby mitcorb » Wed Jul 01, 2009 2:51 am

I don't think he has loop selection of edges--only faces at this time. I might be wrong. He may have updated it. What I am suggesting is already a native tool in Blender and a few other solid modelers.
Selecting a loop of edges could become problematic unless you had options to select at the bifurcations of a heavy triangulated model. Of course, Zorro would make short work of it unless that would be too heavy handed--in some cases a dispassionate slasher.
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Re: Select Perimeter Edges only

Postby thomthom » Wed Jul 01, 2009 7:19 am

Edge Loop, could anyone post a screenshot of what that means? A "Loop" can be interpreted as many things.
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Re: Select Perimeter Edges only

Postby remus » Wed Jul 01, 2009 7:52 am

Here you go.
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Re: Select Perimeter Edges only

Postby thomthom » Wed Jul 01, 2009 8:17 am

The thing about these kind of selections, how do you expect them to work on irregular shaped objects? How do they work in other applications?

If it assumes that the shape is made out of triangles or quads things are very easy.
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Re: Select Perimeter Edges only

Postby pilou » Wed Jul 01, 2009 8:41 am

See TopMod ;) (free)
Have cool loops selection ;)
And it's a crazzy prog :fro: (here old version)
topmod.jpg
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Re: Select Perimeter Edges only

Postby mitcorb » Wed Jul 01, 2009 1:24 pm

Yes, Remus and Pilou:
That is what would be called edge loop selection.
Now, what if the volume were made up of only triangle faces? or a combination of both quads and triangles(either hard or soft edges)
You would want to select the shortest edge loop around the volume, or the longest loop around the volume, or some specific path. You could then duplicate the path in order to subdivide, or do a follow me with an added figure, or an array copy--or whatever.
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Re: Select Perimeter Edges only

Postby notareal » Thu Jul 02, 2009 12:10 pm

Here is a good explanation of edge loop.
http://wiki.cgsociety.org/index.php/Edge_Loop
Edge loop terminates if there 3 or 5 (or more junctions), so for a mesh build with only triangle faces there is no edge loop.
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Re: Select Perimeter Edges only

Postby thomthom » Thu Jul 02, 2009 12:16 pm

Thanks. That helps alot. Such a function is easy to add.

In a stricter sense an edge loop is defined as set of edges where the loop follows the middle edge in every 'four way junction'


I'll add that shortly to my Selection Toys plugin.
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Re: Select Perimeter Edges only

Postby thomthom » Thu Jul 02, 2009 12:18 pm

Only thing is, from the screenshot in that article, I don't think the quad faces are planar. So in SU there'd be a hidden/soft edge across. I could make the script ignore hidden/soft edges, as an option perhaps.
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Re: Select Perimeter Edges only

Postby notareal » Thu Jul 02, 2009 12:25 pm

thomthom wrote:I don't think the quad faces are planar.

That's possible. So option to ignore soft/hidden faces would good.
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Re: Select Perimeter Edges only

Postby thomthom » Thu Jul 02, 2009 12:28 pm

But how many model in SU in such a manner? With only quad faces? With hard edges (with or without soft edges that splits the quad.)
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Re: Select Perimeter Edges only

Postby mitcorb » Thu Jul 02, 2009 2:51 pm

Thomthom:
If an edge loop selection terminates at a 3 or 5 junction, do you see this as terminating the selection or retaining the selection up to the junction? And thereafter the selection is made edge by edge, adding to the path, or restarting the loop selection without losing what has been selected before. Just some thoughts.
How many people model like this, you ask. Because I have some limited experience with Blender, I often think in terms of that workflow (wishing that Sketchup had that versatility) as I model in SU.
In my opinion, this loop selection capability (and your current Selection Toys) is at least as important as the Point Merger tool recently developed and Select only Visible.

Somewhere out there is the Grand Unified Modeling Program....or GUMP for short. (edit: add small chuckle)
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