SketchUp 2018 - first impressions

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SketchUp 2018 - first impressions

Postby derei » Wed Nov 15, 2017 12:25 am

I just installed it and tried to load my bundle from Sketchucation Tools.
First impression is not very encouraging for me:

-SketchUp's Extension Manager was rescanning all extensions, bombarding me with update notifications for each extension that I installed (seems that one of the first extensions was detected as it needs updating and since that one for all, it appeared that pop-up)

-After I installed all extensions, I checked which needed to be updated and it was Eneroth Terrain Eroder and SketchUv.

-Tried to update them. Extension Manager started contradicting itself ("One extension updated successfully" and at the same time: "Failed to update SketchUv. Unable to complete download.")
So, yeah, one of the basic problems is still there, not fixed yet...

Other than that, it mostly seems the same. Probably under the hood are some fixings, but nothing to make the user visibly happy.

Ah: - it just crashed after I installed all extensions and I closed SketchUp. That's a good welcome :D
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Re: SketchUp 2018 - first impressions

Postby derei » Wed Nov 15, 2017 1:19 pm

After reading the full changelog (can be found here: https://help.sketchup.com/en/article/141303 ) I can say there is a lot of change. Some of them (a good share, I may say) are changes that would fit rather in a maintenance release than in a major release, but it is understandable how Trimble may have wanted to bring in front a BIG LIST of changes to impress.

On the other hand, there are some changes that I consider being part of a new release, mostly being related to LayOut and Ruby API. -> Here are a lot of changes, most important ones being that plugin devs now will have the ability to interact with LayOut via code.

Some updates, on the other hand, were pain useless (like filled section cuts), where there is already a fully functional plugin. I don't say that a native integration isn't better, but as long as there are a lot of more urgent issues to fix and obvious problems (like you can't search for a local component using component browser - it will only search in 3d warehouse), maybe the effort would have been better spent on those aspects.

Another questionable improvement would be rectangle draw... which whilst "it may" have its usefulness, the impact of having a fancy modifier when drawing a rectangle is rather small, compared with a better uv-mapping, to say so.

Overall, with the drop of Make version (and the online version not being - apparently - to accept plugins), plus the obvious orientation towards Architects, it seems Trimble's direction to be very clear.
One of the questions that I have now in my mind is if it's really worth for SketchUp to become an architect's tool, where there are already plenty of specialized tools for architects, some of them even better than SketchUp (especially because they are specialized). What was making SketchUp so special was its flexibility and versatility. The flexibility is still there, but less focused on it, less cared about it. Seems it's gonna sink and as another user said "if you don't like it, go to blender" - that came from someone who likes SketchUp to be a "lines drawing tool" and organic or complex modelling should not be part of it - at least that's what I could understand from that statement.

Baseline: SketchUp 2018 came with goods and bads, but seems to be paving the road for more changes (or more promises) - anyway, many of the people who were using the Make version may not benefit anymore of the new incoming features.
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Re: SketchUp 2018 - first impressions

Postby grabuge » Wed Nov 15, 2017 3:48 pm

we just bought 2 pro licences, it seems much slower on big files, is it just me ?
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Re: SketchUp 2018 - first impressions

Postby bobrsta » Wed Nov 15, 2017 5:08 pm

Just downloaded and opened a couple of small files (what I consider to be small). One I did a "save as" to keep my older 2017 file intact, the other, a 26 MB file, I went to save in 2018 format, figuring it'd be easy enough to resave as the 2017 version, and... spinning beach ball! (MacOS).

Had to force quit.

Disappointed barely scratches the surface.

I found 2017 to be very unstable and slow (20+ seconds to save a 140 MB file on an SSD? I can duplicate one that size in about 3). 2018 show no early signs of improvement. Which was all I had really hoped for - A STABLE APPLICATION. Most of the upgrades they tout were available already as darn good plugins.

WTH, Trimble? I really think its time to find an alternative... Ideas, anyone?
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Re: SketchUp 2018 - first impressions

Postby asimonas » Sat Dec 09, 2017 7:28 am

You have my vote bobrsta. Jumped out of my seat when saw new 2018! and then..... opened browser and typed: alternatives to sketchup
yep sketchup sucks again!
no improvements in speed or user interface at all. Sketchup is still slow, crashed from first touch, no isolate objects option, no search for components option in model, still floating toolbars (on mac), no scenes grouping, no improvement in layers organization, still have layers with names 'm', 'c'. And biggest of all is layout being soooo slow! Working in hybrid mode is almost impossible. even zooming in/out or panning is a nightmare. And I have latest iMac 5K 27" i7 4.2 with Radeon Pro 580, 40 GB DDR4 and SSD. All other apps running like a butter, then I open layout and it feels like I'm working o a phone... Shame... looking for alternative at the moment.
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Re: SketchUp 2018 - first impressions

Postby L i am » Sat Dec 09, 2017 7:48 am

Seems to me like trimble concentrates on a "big list"
How about fixing such a simple thing as navigation. We all know mouse navigation is less than good in Sketchup, like consistently fighting my way through invisable wall with smoke eminating from my mouse center wheel.Seems to me 3Dconnexxion solved those issues but trimble cannot?
Same old same old. How about they solve some real problems.
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Re: SketchUp 2018 - first impressions

Postby pbacot » Sat Dec 09, 2017 10:22 am

Thanks guys. I don't see problems with 2016 on the Mac El Capitan. No reason to change anything. Admittedly SU is slow and even hangs AFTER operations are complete on screen. But with these problems and more, still useful. It's mostly the lack of progress that's disappointing.
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Re: SketchUp 2018 - first impressions

Postby Dave R » Sat Dec 09, 2017 3:29 pm

It's unfortunate that the average user can't see all the changes made "under the hood". They might change their opinion that the SketchUp team aren't doing anything. From conversations I've had with a number of the team members, I know they have been working hard at making changes that will allow for more and better features. They introduce new features as they can but a large part of the job is reworking the legacy code without breaking existing features and while chasing the moving target of changing operating systems. Much of the code was allowed to languish during the Google years so there's a lot of time to make up for. Improvements are happening whether the users can see them or not.

So far I've seen a number of nice new features in the last couple of versions. PIDs in SU allow dimensions in LO to be linked directly to the model. And now you can dimension between viewports making it easier add dimensions across break lines. Section cuts have names and show up in Outliner, section fills are nice, The Tape Measure tool has added functionality. Labels in LayOut have more auto text choices... There's still features I'd like to see and I'm confident they'll come.

We all know mouse navigation is less than good in Sketchup,


I don't agree with that statement. I find mouse navigation works quite well in Sketchup. It takes a little practice but I don't find it problematic at all.
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Re: SketchUp 2018 - first impressions

Postby Box » Sat Dec 09, 2017 3:41 pm

And its a shame that if you do express any positive reaction you just get labeled a fan boy.
People don't bother giving good reviews or pointing out the new bits anymore.
So you end up with an unbalanced review.
He who screams loudest isn't always correct.
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Re: SketchUp 2018 - first impressions

Postby Dave R » Sat Dec 09, 2017 3:46 pm

Good point, Box.
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Re: SketchUp 2018 - first impressions

Postby pmolson » Sat Dec 09, 2017 6:59 pm

I like sketchup.
Have used it forever. Never been dissatisfied with new versions or updates.I appreciate the continued efforts to improve the product without breaking it for current users...an almost impossible task I would think.

Every update and every new version it seems like the most criticism comes from users who are using free plugins on the free version. Nothing for nothing is my basic expectation. If the product wants to continue to grow, there will be growing pains.

One can never please everybody and one should not try.

I like sketchup.
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Re: SketchUp 2018 - first impressions

Postby pbacot » Sat Dec 09, 2017 8:05 pm

The "under the hood" changes sound hopeful. On the other hand I haven't heard of a must-have feature in the last couple years to risk having problems people have with 2017 and 2018 versions. So I am OK where I am. It's like a mechanic who's had my car two weeks and it's got some work under the hood, but still has the same problems. Still I keep paying the mechanic so next time I bring it in, he may actually make significant progress. I believe he deserves a decent living for keeping the car running, and I value that. Still if rebuilding the engine is supposed to allow better performance, I wonder why it hasn't yet.
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Re: SketchUp 2018 - first impressions

Postby driven » Sat Dec 09, 2017 8:23 pm

I've used v16, v17 and v18 with El Capitan and see many improvements with each upgrade...

v17 the AA did suffer, but only for display...

I still use v16 for Visualizer, but that's all...

I still use v17, for one of my own extensions I haven't updated...

I wouldn't consider downgrading to v16 [unless you paid me]...

I think it unfair to critique changes you haven't even tested...

I think the SU team is doing a great job...

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Re: SketchUp 2018 - first impressions

Postby Dave R » Sat Dec 09, 2017 10:25 pm

pbacot wrote:Still if rebuilding the engine is supposed to allow better performance, I wonder why it hasn't yet.


It actually has improved performance, though.
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Re: SketchUp 2018 - first impressions

Postby Bobmirdiff » Sun Dec 10, 2017 1:15 am

A quotation from an old Boss comes to mind. "How much do Microsoft and AutoDESK pay ME to Test-Drive their Software?" Trimble appear to be following the same route!
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Re: SketchUp 2018 - first impressions

Postby Dave R » Sun Dec 10, 2017 1:27 am

No one is forcing you to use SketchUp. If it's such a problem, there are other programs out there.
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Re: SketchUp 2018 - first impressions

Postby ValmontR » Sun Dec 10, 2017 7:44 pm

I have been extremely happy with the progress in the new versions. Sure, not a lot of new features have been added, but speed and stability are generally much better. With the new engine (2016 or 2017?) came the ability to create drawings with nearly unlimited numbers of lines and faces. Going WAY back, SU had limits in the hundreds of thousands, and before the new engine about 3 million lines and it choked. Selection became increasingly difficult, triple clicking for a solid ceased working, etc. The improvements in some tools have made the program far easier and less frustrating to use: finding the center of an arc now works most of the time, in the past it was hit and miss; the tape measure tool has become awesome—it's almost thinking ahead of me. Save times can still be extreme so I turned off fixing problems on save—the change in time is dramatic. Since I regularly check my models while drawing and purging there has been no problem. One of my pet peeves remains: the materials pallet on Mac sucks. Sometimes I have to save and reopen a drawing to get it to update, and many times when I paste an object into a drawing it doesn't update. Frequently I draw parts in a separate drawing and to maintain the same materials I copy them from the original drawing to the new one, but on paste the original drawing adds a new material.
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Re: SketchUp 2018 - first impressions

Postby pbacot » Sun Dec 10, 2017 9:22 pm

ValmontR wrote:One of my pet peeves remains: the materials pallet on Mac sucks. Sometimes I have to save and reopen a drawing to get it to update, and many times when I paste an object into a drawing it doesn't update. Frequently I draw parts in a separate drawing and to maintain the same materials I copy them from the original drawing to the new one, but on paste the original drawing adds a new material.


I agree about the palette. Mostly it's the problem that there is no display of material names Unless you mouse over for the SLOW response popup names. Have you tried saving the work in a component with "save as" and "reload"instead of "paste." I don't believe I've see the problem with materials in regards to bringing work into the model.

I consider myself a fanboy.
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Re: SketchUp 2018 - first impressions

Postby driven » Mon Dec 11, 2017 2:04 am

ValmontR wrote:... Sometimes I have to save and reopen a drawing to get it to update...


I find using hot corners or switching windows and back, updates the 'Colors' panel...

it similar to when Finder fails to update a pane...

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Re: SketchUp 2018 - first impressions

Postby L i am » Mon Dec 11, 2017 10:20 am

How many people find navigating in Sketchup frustrating..........like I have said before: scroll wheel smoking as I try as I might to get trough than invisible wall made of viscus mud. It can be fixed, connexion 3D mouse has solved with software, so It can be done. Why has it not been fixed. It is a fundamental problem.
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Re: SketchUp 2018 - first impressions

Postby pmolson » Mon Dec 11, 2017 4:44 pm

The only time I experience behavior that sounds like what you are describing is if I happen to be directly behind an inserted image or some other obstacle right in my face. A quick orbit to the side or up/down and i can quickly navigate past.
Maybe you are experiencing a unique problem.
I find navigation to be fast, responsive, and easy.

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Re: SketchUp 2018 - first impressions

Postby charevir56 » Wed Dec 13, 2017 3:21 am

ValmontR
One of my pet peeves remains: the materials pallet on Mac sucks. Sometimes I have to save and reopen a drawing to get it to update, and many times when I paste an object into a drawing it doesn't update.


Oh!, I thought this behavior was on my end, but like driven I learn that switching windows and back, updates the 'Colors' panel... too bad specially when the model is getting bigger.
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Re: SketchUp 2018 - first impressions

Postby drw12333 » Sun Jan 07, 2018 12:30 am

Are all 3D Warehouse items going to be "2018" only. All that I've tried will not open in 2017.
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Re: SketchUp 2018 - first impressions

Postby Dave R » Mon Jan 08, 2018 11:29 am

drw12333 wrote:Are all 3D Warehouse items going to be "2018" only. All that I've tried will not open in 2017.


No. How have you tried opening them? If you get them directly in SketchUp, they will open with the version you are using as long as it is 2014 or higher. If you are downloading them directly through your browser, you'll have to choose the version you want.
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