SubD examples and models

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Re: SubD examples and models

Postby HornOxx » Sun Jan 17, 2016 4:55 pm

Hi - to get any first experiences I did a little testing, mainly based on Cottys SubD_04 model above. I was interested on how an existing texture behaves to the SubD process - it's amazing how confidently and fast that works ...

Cotty, how did you get this rainbow-colour on that subd23 chair which looks so great - is it texturing?
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Re: SubD examples and models

Postby cotty » Sun Jan 17, 2016 5:09 pm

Nice! Here's the chair texture...
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Re: SubD examples and models

Postby thomthom » Sun Jan 17, 2016 6:04 pm

pilou wrote:
this is because the QFT OBJ importer will ensure non-planar quads are created as QuadFaceTools quads

Sorry I don't see "Import OBJ" on the menus of QuadFaceTools(0.9.1 & 0.9.2) ? :o
Only "Export" ! (SU Make 2016 2015)

Ah, yea, the docs probably don't mention this at all, but it's listed among the other importers:

File > Import
2016-01-17_10h08_03.png


The only reason the exporter isn't among the other exporter is that the API is lacking the interface. Them guys over at SketchUp should fix that! ...oh wait...
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Re: SubD examples and models

Postby thomthom » Sun Jan 17, 2016 6:07 pm

Box wrote:I've never ventured much into the realm of furniture making so as a first quick doodle I'm impressed by the ease with which I came up with something almost recognisable in less than 30 minutes fiddling. No doubt I could render it and make it look flash, but I love the raw topology.

It makes me very happy to hear that. My biggest concern with SUbD was how it relied on quad topology and I wasn't sure how well that requirement of workflow would be received in the realms on SketchUp.
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Re: SubD examples and models

Postby thomthom » Sun Jan 17, 2016 6:23 pm

HornOxx wrote:Hi - to get any first experiences I did a little testing, mainly based on Cottys SubD_04 model above. I was interested on how an existing texture behaves to the SubD process - it's amazing how confidently and fast that works ...


Thanks for sharing that model - it's a nice study of geometry and texture.
At the moment SUbD use simple linear interpolation for the textures. However, I am working with integrating OpenSubdiv into a future release. That will give more options for textures;

2016-01-17_10h24_41.png

Source: http://graphics.pixar.com/library/Geri/paper.pdf
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Re: SubD examples and models

Postby pilou » Sun Jan 17, 2016 6:58 pm

@Thomthom

In fact all works fine! :mrgreen:
It was half my fault! I was too confident of the first reading text! :)

huhu.jpg
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Re: SubD examples and models

Postby cotty » Sun Jan 17, 2016 10:00 pm

SCF_Cotty_subd24.png
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Re: SubD examples and models

Postby pilou » Mon Jan 18, 2016 12:18 am

Tron! ;)
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Re: SubD examples and models

Postby pilou » Mon Jan 18, 2016 12:47 am

Glitch ?

SUbD finds internal faces and can't be apply! (Who don't exist)
(Artisan subdivides ;)

glitch.jpg
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Re: SubD examples and models

Postby thomthom » Mon Jan 18, 2016 1:02 am

SUbD Catmull-Clark algorithm require the mesh to be a manifold or a surface without any forks. That model you have there have an edge with four faces connected - the algorithm cannot handle that. In another modelling package where the entities didn't merge you'd get away with it as you could have overlapping edges. But since SU merges entities at all times these types of scenarios becomes a challenge.

OpenSubdiv 3 supports internal faces - maybe it would be able to cope with this as well - I'm not sure. But that's still down the line in the road map.
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Re: SubD examples and models

Postby Box » Mon Jan 18, 2016 1:06 am

It would be handy if either SubD or Solid inspector could highlight these annoying joints. They can be a real headache to find manually sometimes.
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Re: SubD examples and models

Postby thomthom » Mon Jan 18, 2016 1:18 am

Solid Inspector used to complain about these - but because they where considered false positives in many cases it was changed to ignore them.

I do have ideas for an analytical tool for QFT that will visualize quads from triangles and ngons. Maybe it can lightlight forks as well...

By the way, I tried the model on an experimental build I have where I try to wire up OpenSubdiv and it seemed to be able to cope with it:

2016-01-17_17h16_53.png
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Re: SubD examples and models

Postby pilou » Mon Jan 18, 2016 1:21 am

THx for the explanation and the effort! :fro:
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Re: SubD examples and models

Postby panixia » Mon Jan 18, 2016 1:31 am

thomthom wrote:I do have ideas for an analytical tool for QFT that will visualize quads from triangles and ngons.

:ecstatic: please please auto-detect sausages ad donuts :ecstatic:

somewere i should have a "wishlist" i wrote with some examples included too..
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Re: SubD examples and models

Postby Box » Mon Jan 18, 2016 2:57 pm

Another quick late night doodle just for fun and to help wrap my head around quads.
It's very quick and simple but everything is so easy to manipulate with the combination of QFT, VT and SubD.
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Re: SubD examples and models

Postby olishea » Mon Jan 18, 2016 5:00 pm

nice cotty loving this thread....I'll get involved soon :)
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Re: SubD examples and models

Postby cotty » Mon Jan 18, 2016 7:36 pm

@Box: nice plane!
@ olishea: be careful, it's contagious ;-)
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Re: SubD examples and models

Postby pilou » Mon Jan 18, 2016 7:52 pm

Maybe you can also use the very cool Free ManifoldLab (Wings3D inside) for some cool things!

trig.jpg
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Re: SubD examples and models

Postby cotty » Mon Jan 18, 2016 8:18 pm

Find the difference ;-)

SCF_Cotty_subd25.png
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Re: SubD examples and models

Postby driven » Mon Jan 18, 2016 11:44 pm

got it, two are blue and two are red...
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Re: SubD examples and models

Postby panixia » Tue Jan 19, 2016 12:43 am

not sure what you guys are trying to achieve with this kind of experiments?
what's the point with all those triangles? :|
is just for the sake of testing the algorithm itself or is such topology intended for something?
maybe 3dprinting :?:

here is a children slide done with good old quads :)

slide.JPG

slide 1.JPG

slide 2.JPG
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Re: SubD examples and models

Postby ntxdave » Tue Jan 19, 2016 12:53 am

Going to show my ignorance :?

How do you go about drawing things like this with quads? Is there some place I can go to learn the process or do you just draw everything with straight lines?
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Re: SubD examples and models

Postby panixia » Tue Jan 19, 2016 12:56 am

dave i made a pretty extensive tutorial a few days ago..didn't you spot it?
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Re: SubD examples and models

Postby ntxdave » Tue Jan 19, 2016 1:40 am

panixia wrote:dave i made a pretty extensive tutorial a few days ago..didn't you spot it?
j

Oops...I think I have it book marked on a different computer ( if that is the one about the piece of furniture). My apology. I promise I will watch it. L have been going thru some Blender tuts. I want to learn how to draw things better.
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Re: SubD examples and models

Postby panixia » Tue Jan 19, 2016 2:02 am

actually it's also bookmarked on the sub-d website video.. ;)

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=P ... wU4L5-O7_4

not sure if i should create a topic in the main tutorial section of the forum or in sub-d subforum.. :?:
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Re: SubD examples and models

Postby Box » Tue Jan 19, 2016 6:02 am

Panixia, having stumbled through QFT and SubD by trial and error for a few days I have now watched your tutorial. I think I chose the right time to watch it as it answered all those nagging little questions about how to use the various tools correctly. I now see I was making hard work for myself with quads.
I think it could be a bit overwhelming if you were trying the tools for the first time.
Thankyou for that, an Excellent bit of work, although I almost stopped watching it in the first few minutes because of the computer voice. I'm very glad I persevered.
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Re: SubD examples and models

Postby Box » Tue Jan 19, 2016 1:52 pm

A little engineering porn now that I have my head around quads a little better.
It makes a very nice one piece printable solid.
I need to make more effort with my mounting holes, their topology is a little ragged as they were an afterthought and I got lazy by then.
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Re: SubD examples and models

Postby pbacot » Tue Jan 19, 2016 3:46 pm

Now that's a nice manifold! But I was dismayed by the mounting holes too (just kidding). Good work and example!
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Re: SubD examples and models

Postby panixia » Tue Jan 19, 2016 3:49 pm

Box wrote:I almost stopped watching it in the first few minutes because of the computer voice. I'm very glad I persevered.


:mrgreen: LOL! i know.. that f*%#in' robot voice is so annoyng that actually you should have to be glad, first of all, I MYSELF persevered in doing it.. altough i was actually helped in that phase from a friend who works in education (actually it works at engeneering college and they use all of this nice stuff for teaching/learning :geek: )
that said.. i'm pretty much sure you would be even a lot more pissed by my terrible spoken english, wich is even worse than my written one lol :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:
i have to say (being this my first ever tutorial) that i way understimated how difficult is to model something without jumping/redoing steps, without never undoing or drafting along the way and trying to act in a smooth way.. if you ask me to try to speak english on the top of all this stress... that would drive me completely crazy AAAHRGG :evil:

try to do something similar while speaking italian and let me know :-P

Box wrote:I need to make more effort with my mounting holes, their topology is a little ragged as they were an afterthought and I got lazy by then


if you ask me, the topology of that holes is not wrong at all. maybe (unless you don't intentionally need to hard-pinch them for some reason) you can improve a bit the flow around that x-poles marked in red.

that's not mandatory, but if you dig into topology furthermore, you will learn that, when possible, you should try to move poles around, splitting the x pole in a e-pole (blue) and a n-pole (green) as you properly did at the bottom were you cut those nice loop flowing between holes..

i know all of this can be a little confusing, but poles are very important to achieve proper topology and control the flow and the pinching of the meshes.
maybe i can try to do some example model about this, but unfortunately i have no time to do this right now..

try and search about "poles" there are tons of good tutorials about poles (mosto of them from blender community)

:!: notice that quadface tools provide a useful option to hilight poles in your topology. you should pickthe quadface select tool and activte the poles from right-click menu :thumb:

poles.JPG
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Re: SubD examples and models

Postby thomthom » Tue Jan 19, 2016 4:39 pm

Wonderful manifold Box!

Mind if I share the images? (I'd love to show the coarse mesh and the final subdivided mesh.) I'll add a link-back to whatever you want as attribution.

For the holes - the subdivided mesh doesn't seem to suffer artefacts in this case, you may not want to bother. But if you want to explore further you might want to try something like this:

http://topology-guides.tumblr.com/post/ ... at-surface
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