[RELEASE] Alpha 0.0.10

General discusson for Skatter for SketchUp

Moderator: jiminy-billy-bob

[RELEASE] Alpha 0.0.10

Postby jiminy-billy-bob » Fri Apr 24, 2015 1:14 pm

Alpha 0.0.10

Don't forget to restart Sketchup after install.

Changelog:
  • Added camera limit/clipping
  • Added objects as exclude-only areas
  • Fixed area falloffs weird behaviour
  • Added "New seed" button
  • Changed the options order to something more straightforward

If you use Thea, you will need the latest beta version that Tomasz will release today, otherwise previous versions will crash when trying to render. This is due to some changes under the hood.

If needed, same serial as before : 6sblp-7GdCN-Z1Y3X-E0O4a
1
User avatar
jiminy-billy-bob 
PluginStore Author
PluginStore Author
 

Re: [RELEASE] Alpha 0.0.10

Postby caecarvalho » Fri Apr 24, 2015 8:45 pm

Thanks man! The camera clipping feature is a really usefull option! I'll give it a try this weekend! :thumb:
0

caecarvalho 
 

Re: [RELEASE] Alpha 0.0.10

Postby caecarvalho » Fri Apr 24, 2015 9:47 pm

Hi jbb,

I've just installed the new version and everytime I start sketchup, skatter window opens too. Is it supposed to be like this?
0

caecarvalho 
 

Re: [RELEASE] Alpha 0.0.10

Postby jiminy-billy-bob » Fri Apr 24, 2015 11:20 pm

Crap, I forgot to remove it. Open Plugins/jbb_skatter/rb/main.rb and remove "self.start_dialog" on line 106
0
User avatar
jiminy-billy-bob 
PluginStore Author
PluginStore Author
 

Re: [RELEASE] Alpha 0.0.10

Postby valerostudio » Mon May 04, 2015 4:28 pm

Doesn't seem to work when Render is ticked on with VRay 2.00.25532 is it still Vray compatible?
0

valerostudio 
 

Re: [RELEASE] Alpha 0.0.10

Postby jiminy-billy-bob » Mon May 04, 2015 4:42 pm

Open jbb_skatter/rb/vray.rb and replace one of the Vray versions by 2.00.25532
0
User avatar
jiminy-billy-bob 
PluginStore Author
PluginStore Author
 

Re: [RELEASE] Alpha 0.0.10

Postby andybot » Mon May 04, 2015 6:24 pm

Hi jbb,
I feel bad I haven't been around much to test lately, only so many hours in a day :(
I wanted to ask if you've had any conversations with Chaos Group about the vray parsing times. It takes ridiculously long to process when the number of objects is in the thousands. It's been very quiet in CG land regards vray for sketchup. Either they're hard at work on 3.0, or else ready to kill it off... dunno whether to be :enlight: or :evil:

Andy
0
my blog featuring recent projects
User avatar
andybot 
Premium Member
Premium Member
 

Re: [RELEASE] Alpha 0.0.10

Postby jiminy-billy-bob » Mon May 04, 2015 6:33 pm

I did send them some benchmarking I made, a few month ago. I didn't have a response at that time, and my contact was Devin. If you haven't heard, he left the company.
I sent Joe and Noel an email a few weeks ago about Skatter, but haven't had any answer about it. So I need to make better contact with them before discussing these issues.

I really hope they fix it, because from what I found out, more than 90% of the parsing time happened AFTER Vray has parsed the model and write everything to an XML file. It's the time Vray takes to read that file and start the render.
This is really weird, and it means it's not related to Sketchup or its ruby API.
0
User avatar
jiminy-billy-bob 
PluginStore Author
PluginStore Author
 

Re: [RELEASE] Alpha 0.0.10

Postby Pixero » Mon May 04, 2015 6:43 pm

Long parsing times was one of the reasons why I ditched Vray4SU for Thea4SU.
It's incredibly fast :D
1
User avatar
Pixero 
 

Re: [RELEASE] Alpha 0.0.10

Postby jiminy-billy-bob » Mon May 04, 2015 6:45 pm

Yes, Tomasz did an incredible job on this subject.
1
User avatar
jiminy-billy-bob 
PluginStore Author
PluginStore Author
 

Re: [RELEASE] Alpha 0.0.10

Postby valerostudio » Mon May 04, 2015 7:00 pm

1- That didn't seem to work for me - get a VRay Error, then VR wont start at all.

2 - I am starting to get that same feeling when 1.49.01 sat around quietly for a long time. I fear now that without Devin, things on 3.0 probably slowed down. No word of even a private beta in a very long time.
0

valerostudio 
 

Re: [RELEASE] Alpha 0.0.10

Postby jiminy-billy-bob » Mon May 04, 2015 7:09 pm

valerostudio wrote:1- That didn't seem to work for me - get a VRay Error, then VR wont start at all.

What error, exactly?
0
User avatar
jiminy-billy-bob 
PluginStore Author
PluginStore Author
 

Re: [RELEASE] Alpha 0.0.10

Postby andybot » Mon May 04, 2015 8:35 pm

Pixero wrote:Long parsing times was one of the reasons why I ditched Vray4SU for Thea4SU.
It's incredibly fast :D


Now that I've got an SSD for my main harddrive, I've not had many issues with the current vfs and parsing. The parsing (like jbb mentioned - the problem happens after vray writes the xml) [edit] is a problem for me only when using skatter, because of the many instances placed. [/edit]

A note of interest, not sure if it's anything similar. During the development of Vray for Blender - there was an issue where a proxy was written out for each instance in the model (something like that, not sure the exact technical description.) this lead to long times to start a render. Subsequently, it was changed so that copies of the same proxies were written only once (or something like that) so that vray wasn't processing multiple copies of the same proxy. I'd be curious if there's some similar problem with vfs 2.0

Yep, I know Devin is no longer there. I was hoping someone else there would have reached out. Not a good sign that there hasn't been any word from them on any fronts.
0
Last edited by andybot on Mon May 04, 2015 9:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
my blog featuring recent projects
User avatar
andybot 
Premium Member
Premium Member
 

Re: [RELEASE] Alpha 0.0.10

Postby andybot » Mon May 04, 2015 8:49 pm

valerostudio wrote:Doesn't seem to work when Render is ticked on with VRay 2.00.25532 is it still Vray compatible?


works fine for me. Did you edit the vray.rb as described?

2015-05-04_155452.png
0
my blog featuring recent projects
User avatar
andybot 
Premium Member
Premium Member
 

Re: [RELEASE] Alpha 0.0.10

Postby jiminy-billy-bob » Mon May 04, 2015 8:57 pm

andybot wrote:The parsing seems only a problem in relation to skatter

It's not related to Skatter, the issue appears everytime there are too much objects.
0
User avatar
jiminy-billy-bob 
PluginStore Author
PluginStore Author
 

Re: [RELEASE] Alpha 0.0.10

Postby andybot » Mon May 04, 2015 9:04 pm

jiminy-billy-bob wrote:
andybot wrote:The parsing seems only a problem in relation to skatter

It's not related to Skatter, the issue appears everytime there are too much objects.


got it. Guess I don't typically have scenes with this many objects, I'd be curious to test this sometime.
0
my blog featuring recent projects
User avatar
andybot 
Premium Member
Premium Member
 

Re: [RELEASE] Alpha 0.0.10

Postby jiminy-billy-bob » Mon May 04, 2015 9:08 pm

You can try by unchecking the "Render" checkbox before generating. This will generate regular components, like you could with any other tool than Skatter (the result would be the same if you place all of them by hand)
You'll see you'll have very long parsing time as well. Even a bit longer than using Skatter's render only feature. (That's what I saw, at least)
0
User avatar
jiminy-billy-bob 
PluginStore Author
PluginStore Author
 

Re: [RELEASE] Alpha 0.0.10

Postby andybot » Mon May 04, 2015 9:25 pm

jiminy-billy-bob wrote:You can try by unchecking the "Render" checkbox before generating. This will generate regular components, like you could with any other tool than Skatter (the result would be the same if you place all of them by hand)
You'll see you'll have very long parsing time as well. Even a bit longer than using Skatter's render only feature. (That's what I saw, at least)


ah, of course. Yep, excessive parsing either way. Wow, amazing the comparison though of having all those components loaded regularly versus with skatter. Once again, really amazing plugin!!
0
my blog featuring recent projects
User avatar
andybot 
Premium Member
Premium Member
 

Re: [RELEASE] Alpha 0.0.10

Postby valerostudio » Tue May 05, 2015 1:18 pm

I did a fresh install, deleted all files and reinsalled and then updated the vray.rb file and it works now!
0

valerostudio 
 

Re: [RELEASE] Alpha 0.0.10

Postby valerostudio » Tue May 05, 2015 1:30 pm

When using the Render ticked method with V-Ray, are the scattered items treated like proxies at render time? Did a test render with the Render ticked on a grass model, 51.3 seconds ; then turned that grass model into a proxy and ran a render, 1m 5.5seconds which shocked me. It's more efficient not to use Skatter with proxies? That's interesting.
0

valerostudio 
 

Re: [RELEASE] Alpha 0.0.10

Postby jiminy-billy-bob » Tue May 05, 2015 1:36 pm

Skatter simply creates informations of where and how to place instances of a particular component definition (without actually generating them).
So if the component contains a proxy, all those items will be proxies, otherwise they won't.

That's indeed very interesting that using proxies is slower. I'll do some tests.
0
User avatar
jiminy-billy-bob 
PluginStore Author
PluginStore Author
 

Re: [RELEASE] Alpha 0.0.10

Postby JQL » Tue May 05, 2015 1:47 pm

valerostudio wrote:When using the Render ticked method with V-Ray, are the scattered items treated like proxies at render time? Did a test render with the Render ticked on a grass model, 51.3 seconds ; then turned that grass model into a proxy and ran a render, 1m 5.5seconds which shocked me. It's more efficient not to use Skatter with proxies? That's interesting.


I bet it has nothing to do with proxies but with the translation of proxies to real vray geometry.

Maybe that translation took the extra time, but if you let the render cook that will be neglectable.
1
User avatar
JQL 
Premium Member
Premium Member
 

Re: [RELEASE] Alpha 0.0.10

Postby jiminy-billy-bob » Tue May 05, 2015 1:51 pm

I was under the impression he was talking about parsing time, not render time. But now I doubt.
0
User avatar
jiminy-billy-bob 
PluginStore Author
PluginStore Author
 

Re: [RELEASE] Alpha 0.0.10

Postby andybot » Tue May 05, 2015 1:55 pm

vfs internally converts everything in the scene to proxies afaik. Yes, it does seem like it takes longer to process proxy versus component, I'll try a test too.
1
my blog featuring recent projects
User avatar
andybot 
Premium Member
Premium Member
 

Re: [RELEASE] Alpha 0.0.10

Postby andybot » Tue May 05, 2015 2:18 pm

I did a quick test:

with or without proxy, the xml is written in about 7 secs.

to start rendering (not completion - render takes 32 sec. in each case)

component, 1:32

proxy, 0:37

proxy 3x faster...

attached is my test file
1
my blog featuring recent projects
User avatar
andybot 
Premium Member
Premium Member
 

Re: [RELEASE] Alpha 0.0.10

Postby solo » Thu May 07, 2015 8:52 pm

Is there some sort of collision control option?
1
http://www.solos-art.com

If you see a toilet in your dreams do not use it.
User avatar
solo 
Global Moderator
 

Re: [RELEASE] Alpha 0.0.10

Postby Pixero » Thu May 07, 2015 9:29 pm

I believe there will be a limited variant were overlapping bounding boxes will get deleted.
Would be great to have som sort if collision detection thought for things like gravel and stones that gets stacked on top of each other.
1
User avatar
Pixero 
 

Re: [RELEASE] Alpha 0.0.10

Postby JQL » Mon May 11, 2015 10:50 am

Pixero wrote:I believe there will be a limited variant were overlapping bounding boxes will get deleted.
Would be great to have som sort if collision detection thought for things like gravel and stones that gets stacked on top of each other.


Won't high poly model's collision detection be a too heavy task for SU?

What if we could have Skatter compare the proxy geometry, the bounding box or real geometry by choosing na option on the specific skatter object?

Then we could, if we would really care for it, make a simpler proxy where collision detection would be simpler to calculate but more aproximate than the bounding box.
1
User avatar
JQL 
Premium Member
Premium Member
 

Re: [RELEASE] Alpha 0.0.10

Postby jiminy-billy-bob » Mon May 11, 2015 3:06 pm

Sorry but I'm won't add full geometry collision detection. Or if I do, in a distant future.
Skatter is no physics simulator. Although, you can use it in conjunction with MSPhysics/SketchyPhysics.
1
User avatar
jiminy-billy-bob 
PluginStore Author
PluginStore Author
 

Re: [RELEASE] Alpha 0.0.10

Postby Rich O Brien » Mon May 11, 2015 7:02 pm

When u plan on releasing?

Need any testimonials or similar?
1
There's a frontroom and a backroom....reverse faces
User avatar
Rich O Brien 
Administrator
 

SketchUcation One-Liner Adverts

by Ad Machine » 5 minutes ago



Ad Machine 
Robot
 

Next


 

Return to Skatter

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

Visit our sponsors: