The "Duh!" thread (aka the Doh! thread)

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Re: The "Duh!" thread (aka the Doh! thread)

Postby KXI System » Fri Mar 05, 2010 12:38 am

Jim wrote:Just learned the physical size of the SU window matters when trying to print to scale.

No matter what I did I could not get my unscaled print on a single page, even though it would have easily fit on a single page. After making the SU window narrower than the height, SketchUp decided it would fit a a single sheet after all.


Found that out the hard way, 100 prints to just get close...
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Re: Move tool can rotate, too

Postby jgb » Fri Mar 05, 2010 6:27 pm

Ecuadorian wrote:I changed the thread title in order to collect more "Duh!" moments here.

A couple of minutes ago, I just realized that the "Move" tool has a rotate function incorporated when you select a component. Just hover your mouse over any of the six faces of the bounding box and you'll see four red crosses. Select any of them to rotate your component around its center.

Another "Duh!" moment brought to you by a SketchUp newbie. I guess it's time to read the 887-page long manual from start to end.


Keep in mind the [move] tool rotate is a bit different from the [rotate] tool.

With move/rotate the 4 selection grab points (red +) are inset at mid point of the sides of the bounding box, BUT the actual axis of rotation is only perpendicular to the centroid of the bounding box selection face, regardless of the objects actual shape and mass center. The [move] tool can ONLY rotate groups and components, no other objects.

The rotate tools selection point is anywhere on any selected object(s) (anywhere in the drawing) and the rotation axis is perpendicular to the face at the selection point. If you need to rotate the object on an axis not perpendicular to the selection face, you need to place the protractor on a parallel face then [shift] move and then [click] the protractor to the selection point and complete the rotation. Otherwise you will need a temporary face to force the axis alignment for the rotate. The temp face need not be on any actual face of the object, but as a safeguard, group it first to avoid merging. To aid in placing the protractor center correctly, place a guide line in the desired axis of rotation, passing through the temp face. Place the protractor center on the intersection of the guide line through the temp face and complete the rotation.
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Re: The "Duh!" thread

Postby jgb » Fri Mar 05, 2010 6:47 pm

Pilou wrote:
My Spacebar doesn't deselect - disappointed.

You right : I was no precise! :oops:
That deselect "tools" ! :)

Deselect selected is of course clicked an empty space ;)


[ctrl]T deselects all. Sometimes you cannot see empty space to click on.

That was my "Duh" moment after more than a year of using SU and frustration with deselections from inside my models.

Another "Duh" was using the [extrude] tool to quickly "select" (highlight actually) faces to reverse or delete. Just hover the tool over the face (NO clicking) and using shortcut keys "D" = delete, "R" = reverse face to either delete them or reverse them. Very fast that way for multiple faces. Gaieus gave me that one. There are other tools and functions you can use as well.
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Re: The "Duh!" thread

Postby jgb » Fri Mar 05, 2010 9:05 pm

Jeff Hammond wrote:
paulside wrote:Come on, Own up, how many of us have tried to orbit a jpg ! :roflmao:


i try to orbit everything on my computer after a long SU session.. web pages etc...

it's like jumping on a trampoline for a while.. once you get back on solid ground, it takes a few minutes to readjust..

Like the famous Indian explorer, Binder Dundat, I have a 2D graphics app for GIF animation creation. [Orbit] does not work in that. Pity......
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Re: The "Duh!" thread

Postby jgb » Fri Mar 05, 2010 9:12 pm

Gaieus wrote:
thomthom wrote:...
Ever tried to undo a wrong stroke with the pen..? :oops:

Or with a girlfriend? :roll:


English teacher remarks to young Johnny that his spelling and punctuation has improved considerably.
Johnny say "I had too. My older sister caught a major screaming session with Mom & Dad when she missed a period." :family:
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Re: The "Duh!" thread (aka the Doh! thread)

Postby Ultimatez 32 » Sat Mar 06, 2010 9:22 am

My Duh! of today...

I just noticed you can use 'paste in place' for moving ungrouped geometry inside an already grouped geometry. It helps a lot when you are outlining something in a blueprint and then paste in place in a group, like a plane's wing for intersection.

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Re: The "Duh!" thread

Postby plot-paris » Sat Mar 13, 2010 11:02 am

jgb wrote:English teacher remarks to young Johnny that his spelling and punctuation has improved considerably.
Johnny say "I had too. My older sister caught a major screaming session with Mom & Dad when she missed a period."

:roflmao:
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Re: The "Duh!" thread (aka the Doh! thread)

Postby pilou » Mon May 17, 2010 8:08 am

This :pushpull: and the Offset tool keep their last measures even you use some other tools between them! :o
So the "Double Click" is some efficient! :roll: :oops: :enlight:
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Re: The "Duh!" thread (aka the Doh! thread)

Postby brookefox » Mon May 17, 2010 11:30 pm

Pilou wrote:This :pushpull: and the Offset tool keep their last measures even you use some other tools between them! So the "Double Click" is some efficient!


Please clarify for the snail within. Double click to edit group/component with the preset distances?
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Re: The "Duh!" thread (aka the Doh! thread)

Postby TIG » Mon May 17, 2010 11:39 pm

Several tools remember the last used value [during that session] - Offset and PushPull are the main ones.
Make an Offset on a Face - enter 100.
Later Choose the Offset Tool again and double-click on a Face - it will Offset 100...
Do a PushPull on a Face - enter 10.
Later Choose the PushPull Ttool again and double-click on a Face - it will PushPull 10...

Type in new values if you desire...

SUp tries to be helpful in your working methods... :D
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Re: The "Duh!" thread (aka the Doh! thread)

Postby pilou » Tue May 18, 2010 1:12 am

Thx I can't say better or I c'ant better say! :enlight:
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Last edited by pilou on Tue May 18, 2010 1:14 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The "Duh!" thread (aka the Doh! thread)

Postby brookefox » Tue May 18, 2010 1:13 am

OK, thanks. I am not used to the command first -> selection second mode, which I should practice.

Might it be nice if the VCB window showed the remembered value at first when the command is picked?
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Re: The "Duh!" thread (aka the Doh! thread)

Postby Chris Fullmer » Tue May 18, 2010 4:12 am

I would guess that most people when using the pushpull tool would select the push pull tool first, and then hover over the desired face to push pull it. Offset I often go either way. I generally use it without selecting anything first, unless I specfically need to make a selection. Move tool I find I make my selection forst almost always. Same thing with the scale tool. Just do whichever is faster for you.
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Re: The "Duh!" thread (aka the Doh! thread)

Postby broomstick » Fri May 21, 2010 7:20 am

Since I'm used to archicad i find it tedious to reactivate selection tool, select item, move it and repeat. So when things are still simple, I keep the move tool activated and select objects right clicking on them ;)
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Re: The "Duh!" thread (aka the Doh! thread)

Postby pyroluna » Tue May 25, 2010 11:59 am

don't forget the shortcut for selecting... it's spacebar, an extremely accessible key :enlight: and the "m" for move is just above it!
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Re: The "Duh!" thread (aka the Doh! thread)

Postby TIG » Tue May 25, 2010 12:16 pm

Using shortcuts is the single most effective way of speeding up your workflow... :ugeek:
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Re: The "Duh!" thread

Postby Ben Ritter » Tue May 25, 2010 6:48 pm

thomthom wrote:Some Duh! moments I've had:

Realising the Taper tool could be used to scale a model.

Realising that I could change the radius of a circle that's been extruded.


The taper tool? Is this my duh moment? OK, where? A plugin?
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Re: The "Duh!" thread (aka the Doh! thread)

Postby thomthom » Tue May 25, 2010 6:50 pm

I meant the Tape Measure tool.
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Re: The "Duh!" thread (aka the Doh! thread)

Postby thomthom » Tue May 25, 2010 6:51 pm

However, FredoScale does have a taper tool: viewtopic.php?f=323&t=17948
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Re: The "Duh!" thread

Postby Ben Ritter » Tue May 25, 2010 7:00 pm

Boofredlay wrote:One for me was when Gaieus was from Gaieus' talk at the Basecamp (I saw the video) and using the rotate tool.

When you click the rotate tool and click the rotation point, don't let go of the mouse button... drag it out to either red or green (or any other snap point you set up) then click to start. This relieves any need for a vertical plane to get your rotation set up.

See image for example.

ClickHold.jpg


I have been using SU since V2 and never knew that until last year.


Ooh, wow, that one hurts. In a good way.
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Re: The "Duh!" thread (aka the Doh! thread)

Postby Ultimatez 32 » Mon Jun 28, 2010 8:30 am

Hi Guys,

Just had a Duh! moment. I just noticed there is a 'show nested components' tick box in model info -> statistics. So that's why I can't see my polygon count when I create a group :lol: (thanks thomthom)

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Re: The "Duh!" thread

Postby danbig » Tue Jun 29, 2010 12:42 am

xrok1 wrote:i think the biggest duh moment of all that everbody (hopfully) goes through is realizing that it matters which way the faces are oriented.

90% of the 3dwarehouse posters still havn't had that duh moment. :lol:



...ok, I'd better ask, because my mind is blank after reading this.

What do you mean, "it matters which way the faces are oriented"?

This is either something I know, in different terms, or something I don't know at all.
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Re: The "Duh!" thread (aka the Doh! thread)

Postby Rich O Brien » Tue Jun 29, 2010 1:02 am

Hi,

What Rocky is saying is the when you create geometry that your faces are all White not Blue.

If you draw a simple square on the ground plane you notice it's blue. It's basically the inside face of a yet to be push/pulled object. Once you pull it up the remaining faces are created with White faces out and blue in.

The problem with not orientating your faces correctly becomes apparent if you create a face within a face, and reverse one face so it's blue. Now if you pull one face then orbit you'll see the havoc it can cause!

Rule #1: always orientate your faces!

Rule #2: read rule #1
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Re: The "Duh!" thread (aka the Doh! thread)

Postby Chris Fullmer » Tue Jun 29, 2010 1:18 am

In 3d modeler's, traditionally faces have a front and a back side to them. Some modeler's have ignored the backsides of faces, so if the face was pointing away from the camera, the renderer would just ignore that face (it would not appear in your render, making for lots of holes in the model if you were not careful about getting faces oriented correctly).

I SketchUp, the default material light color face is the front face, and the blue-ish purpley color is the back side of the face. So in some people's eyes, it is important to always model so that the white side of the face is pointing outward (like if you make a box, all walls should be white, and all blue walls should be facing the inside of the box).

Most renderers can deal with materials applied to the backside of faces now, so it is not as important as it was previously. But some people (most?, many?, I don't know) still argue that it is important to model that way. It could be cosidered a Best Modeling Practice to some degree.

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Re: The "Duh!" thread (aka the Doh! thread)

Postby pilou » Tue Jun 29, 2010 1:26 am

And hoppfully as soon as you Pull (in Sketchup) a simple rectangular blue surface (bad oriented) :o
that's magic this blue surface becomes a "white volume"! (so well oriented) :D
And no problem* to the end of your session :mrgreen:

*If you have not some circonvoluted volumes! :lol:
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Re: The "Duh!" thread (aka the Doh! thread)

Postby Gaieus » Tue Jun 29, 2010 7:28 am

You can also think this way; in the physical world everything has some thickness (even a sheet of paper). Now there are two kinds of 3D modellers; "solid" modellers and "surface" modellers (like SketchUp) where everything is made up of faces (and their bounding edges).

Now a front face should always look "outward" of a (fake) "solid" while the back face should be oriented inwards thus indicating that in that direction there is just the "thickness" of the object.

As said above, some 3rd party rendering software do not like back faces but neither do some other applications - for instance if you want to 3D print something, these back faces will drive some printers crazy.

In SU itself it is really not too important nowadays. I still remember however that even Google Earth did not like back faces and rendered only black colours where they were exposed (this has been solved by more modern exporters ever since).
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Re: The "Duh!" thread (aka the Doh! thread)

Postby thomthom » Tue Jun 29, 2010 8:35 am

It gets even more important when you start sending models through a render engines - many features there demand that your normals are oriented correctly.
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Re: The "Duh!" thread

Postby SketchUpNoobie » Wed Jun 30, 2010 1:21 pm

broomstick wrote:
thomthom wrote:A more recent Duh I had:

Being able to select only a few edges from a face and offset them instead of the whole face.


I had this one today!!


Wow. I didn't know that! I thought you had to offset the whole thing then erase unwanted lines and draw wanted lines. Duh! :oops:
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Re: The "Duh!" thread

Postby SketchUpNoobie » Wed Jun 30, 2010 1:25 pm

xrok1 wrote:the duh moment that turned out to just be a der! moment. :roflmao:

but seriously you can copy your construction lines with (ctrl) copy, and then say *10 or whatever so you get 10 equally spaced. if that helps?


Duh! Wow again! I have such a hard time dividing stuff like 7 3/16" into 3 equal sections. This helps a lot! Thanks!
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Re: The "Duh!" thread

Postby TIG » Wed Jun 30, 2010 1:38 pm

SketchupNoobie wrote:
xrok1 wrote:the duh moment that turned out to just be a der! moment. :roflmao:

but seriously you can copy your construction lines with (ctrl) copy, and then say *10 or whatever so you get 10 equally spaced. if that helps?


Duh! Wow again! I have such a hard time dividing stuff like 7 3/16" into 3 equal sections. This helps a lot! Thanks!

Move+ctrl to copy + typed 'dimension' + <enter> moves the copy by that 'dimension'.
Immediately typing 10x [or 10* or x10 or *10 !] will copy 10 times, at that dimension each time.
Alternatively immediately typing /10 will take the 'dimension' as the total distance and make 10 copies that are fitted into the distance, dividing the 'dimension' into 10 equal parts - as you say great if you want to subdivide 7 3/16" into 3 parts without worrying about the Math.
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